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Post by Cindy on Sept 28, 2023 11:39:09 GMT -5
A Rheumatoid Arthritis symptom you don’t hear much about
Did you ever have déjà vu? How about déjà vu over and over? A couple of days ago, I met yet another person with Rheumatoid Arthritis who thought she might be the only one who experienced voice loss due to RA.
Why does every RA’er I meet with vocal cord (cricoarytenoid) arthritis feel like they are the only one? You just don’t hear much about this symptom of Rheumatoid Arthritis? Why are we so quiet about this?
Are vocal cord problems due to Rheumatoid Arthritis really rare? You can find lots of websites and literature which say that vocal cord arthritis due to RA is atypical – where you can find it mentioned at all, that is. Usually, it is not mentioned.
So, how common is cricoarytenoid Rheumatoid Arthritis?
Very. Some “arthritis” materials estimate the rate of cricoarytenoid involvement to be anywhere between 17 and 75%. No wonder people are confused. At least 35% of RA’ers complain of hoarseness, a common symptom of cricoarytenoid RA.
But wait! Post mortem studies range from 45 – 88%. I have read a couple of journal articles which find autopsy evidence of laryngeal Rheumatoid Arthritis in 87% of patients. An American College of Rheumatology report found that 7 out of 8 RA patients showed histopathologic changes postmortem. They stated, “Arthritis of the cricoarytenoid joint occurs much more frequently in patients with rheumatoid disease than has generally been suspected.”
What can Rheumatoid Arthritis do to the vocal cords?
Rheumatoid Arthritis can affect the larynx in several ways. There are joints amid tiny bones (actually made of cartilage) called the cricoid and the arytenoid within the larynx. Oddly enough, the joints are called the cricoarytenoid joints.
These joints can be attacked by Rheumatoid Arthritis, just as other joints can. Sometimes, RA creates an erosive mass in the joint. Nodules may form on the vocal cord tissues which are similar to nodules on other joints. Inflammation in the larynx can lead to vocal cord fixation or vocal cord immobility.
Other types of systemic autoimmune arthritic diseases such as Ankylosing Spondylitis, Reactive arthritis, and Sjögren’s syndrome can also lead to these conditions.
What RA symptoms occur in vocal cord RA?
Here is what to watch for:giraffe 2
hoarseness
change in range of voice
pain during speaking
pain during swallowing
feeling of fullness or mass in the throat
choking sensation
shortness of breath
difficulty breathing
Weird but true facts about Cricoarytenoid RA symtoms
Symptoms may be acute or mild. They may be intermittent or persistent. Symptoms do not depend upon the duration or severity of the Rheumatoid Arthritis or on the age of the patient. Swelling or redness may or may not be observable during laryngoscope. It is even possible to have cricoarytenoid RA without observable symptoms.
Other types of pain
Rheumatoid arthritis in the cricoarytenoid joints is not always physically painful. However, not being able to speak or sing can be traumatic. It is also frightening to live with intermittent choking or difficulty breathing.
Part 2:
Cricoarytenoid Arthritis is a secondary Rheumatoid Arthritis symptom
Rheumatoid Arthritis attacked my vocal cords during that first year of this “flare” (now almost 4 years old). Out of the blue, my voice would disappear. For hours or days, I could only whisper. But, even on good days, I could no longer sing…
It was traumatic to lose the ability to sing. I remember barely being able to walk, struggling to get to a pew at church, and feeling sad that I could not raise my arms as we sang songs of praise. And then one day, I could not sing either.
As the room full of people rejoiced, the words of the song stung my heart: “…we raise our voices… we raise our hands…“ I could do neither. I could barely move.
I felt the Lord speak into my heart that He was aware of me. I knew He was satisfied with the only offering that I could bring – a broken body and silent praise. I sat perfectly still and wept.
More important things to worry about than the hoarseness as an RA symptom…
I have done a lot of reading about Rheumatoid Arthritis. Somewhere, I had found “hoarseness of RA” on a list of Rheumatoid Arthritis symptoms. So, I chalked it up to the weirdness of “this monster,” as WarmSocks called RA in a comment yesterday. I let it go. I had a lot more urgent symptoms with which to be concerned.
Several months after I’d lost my voice the first time, I experienced another symptom of cricoarytenoid arthritis (CA). One evening, my kids jumped for water and prayed for help because I could not breathe. Yes, I was scared.
For about a minute, it was as if I were choking or someone’s hands were around my throat. Then, my throat relaxed a little. Gradually, I began to breathe normally.
This scenario was repeated numerous times. I did not relate this breathing problem to the RA. Would you? However, I kept up my reading and research on RA…
One afternoon last year, I was sitting at the computer, researching for my RA 101. I was trying to understand the ways that Rheumatoid Arthritis attacks the lungs. I called out to my kids, “Come quick!” For the first time, I had stumbled upon an article on CA and dyspnea (breathing difficulty) related to RA. After that, I was like a dog with a bone, digging up answers.
Some degree of vocal cord immobility is a common result of cricoarytenoid RA. It can lead to hoarseness, loss of voice, or trouble breathing. You can read more about that on yesterday’s post.
Maybe we ought to categorize this post under “Ripley’s Believe It or Not.”
Funny thing happened: now that I knew what I was looking for, I kept running across people who had been affected by cricoarytenoid RA. Some were searching for an answer to their “hoarseness” problem. Others had been damaged in some way because it had taken too long to get answers. (One example: read the Health Central discussion which took place earlier this year. The woman’s cousin lives with a permanent tracheotomy since her case was so severe. You may recognize one of the names in the comments section.)
Eventually, I was scared enough to see a doctor about my vocal cords. I called the office of an ENT who had treated 5 members of my family. I asked a nurse to ask the doctor whether he treats vocal cord immobility caused by Rheumatoid Arthritis. I would be happy if they’d call me back to let me know. She put me on hold, came back in 5 minutes, and said this: “He said, ‘Tell her if she can’t breathe, cut a trache.’” Sad, but true.
Since I know someone will ask, I’ll tell you that lately my voice is strong. You would laugh if you could hear how loudly I sing in my car. I’m not wasting a minute of it.
Cricoarytenoid Arthritis, Part 3.
Doing research on Rheumatoid Arthritis, I have encountered several remarkable RA stories – all with actual lives attached! One of those lives is a fun loving lady named Stephanie. Today’s blog is a treat: in this profile in courage, you’ll meet a fellow RA’er who lost her voice permanently in 2004 due to Cricoarytenoid Arthritis.
How did I find out Stephanie has CA? I knew that she had Rheumatoid Arthritis and we had chit-chatted a little on Twitter. I had seen her cooking blog. One night, I noticed her bio said “voiceless chickie.” I knew that was either some weird joke – or her RA!
Steph’s RA story
Stephanie has had RA most all of her life. Her Juvenile Rheumatoid Arthritis began at age two. She endured years with no RA treatment due to the confusion of doctors about JRA and the state of science / RA treatments at the time. She even waited for an entire year to see a rheumatologist on two occasions.
The doctors were unable to recognize all of Steph’s RA symptoms as Rheumatoid Arthritis. Some of her main complaints were problems with her tendons, eyes, skin, lungs, and you guessed it: her larynx. Of course, she has had lots of joint pain and weakness, too.
Steph’s vocal cords left her unable to speak for 5 whole years. Her many years with untreated or undertreated Rheumatoid Arthritis left her vocal cords and lungs permanently damaged.
Moral to Steph’s RA / CA story
There are at least two morals to Stephanie’s Cricoarytenoid RA story:
First: There is no perfectly typical pattern to Rheumatoid Arthritis onset.
Second: However, it is critical that we promote better education of doctors, patients, and the public about what Rheumatoid Arthritis can do to a person so that early diagnosis and treatment is possible. This brave woman has many other things to teach us. I hope you will read her whole story on our Onset Story pages. The ending is not only fascinating, but critically relevant for many of the goals of RA Warrior.
Note: In this video on her own blog you can actually hear Stephanie’s voice which has recovered slightly now that she has begun to take the DMARD methotrexate to treat her RA during the last few months.rawarrior.com/cricoarytenoid-arthritis-in-rheumatoid-arthritis-part-1/rawarrior.com/cricoarytenoid-arthritis-in-rheumatoid-arthritis-part-2/rawarrior.com/cricoarytenoid-arthritis-in-rheumatoid-arthritis-part-3/
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395 
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Post by fearnot on Sept 28, 2023 23:31:34 GMT -5
Wow! Cindy....Thank you ever ever ever so so so much!!!
It may seem weird to you, but somehow that was totally uplifting!!!
Yes, my voice is 90-95 percent gone, on some rare days, it's only 80% for a short amount of time.
but some days, It is so tiring to even try to squeak out a few words,
or even to whisper.
and some days, I cannot even squeak above a very very soft whisper.
But now and again, I can talk very hoarsely for 5-10 minutes,
before it's just too hard, too taxing, too tiring
and useless to even try.
But to know that this may be what it is....just was a kind of relief.
And even 10-15 years ago, I went to a head of an arthritis dept. at a BIG hospital in Portland,
the x-rays showed a ton of nodules all over my back, lower and upper, and shoulders,and neck...due to arthritis
so it kind of makes sense that they could have made their way to my throat.
It is so weird,
but just knowing that actually gave me tears,
somehow that was a strange comfort.....
I guess just knowing that is a good possibility of what is going on!!
So thank you again for taking the time
One thing they did not mention is coughing a lot sometimes....
but oh well...
so much of what 'was' written fit perfectly!!!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Sept 29, 2023 0:02:07 GMT -5
The dead will not live,
the departed spirits will not rise;
Therefore You have punished and destroyed them,
And You have wiped out all remembrance of them.
Isaiah 26:14
These dead were the unbelieving, ungodly, unsaved sinning tyrants...
and therefore,
not only will they not be able to hurt God's people ever again,
they will never be seen again.
This is the unhappy, miserable,eternal end of the wicked.
On the other hand:
You have increased the nation, O Lord,
You have increased the nation,
You are glorified;
You have extended all the borders of the land.
Isaiah 26:15
This speaks of Israel's future restoration...
and by it, God is glorified!
The words:
they could only whisper a prayer....
O Lord , they sought You in distress;
They could only whisper a prayer,
Your chastening was upon them.
Isaiah 26:16
Hardship is often what finally brings a person or a nation to pray!
God's chastening, can be a mercy, when it brings a person to heart felt prayers!
Done for today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Sept 29, 2023 10:54:35 GMT -5
As the pregnant woman approaches the time to give birth,
She writhes and cries out in her labor pains,
Thus were we before You, O Lord .
Isaiah 26:17
Israel suffered and Isaiah compares it to a woman in labor.
They suffered knowing they had displeased God, therefore it was an acute anguish.
However, the comparison ends,
with this next verse...
in that,
a woman's suffering finally gives birth to a new human,
but their suffering, availed nothing of the sort.
We were pregnant, we writhed in labor,
We gave birth, as it seems, only to wind.
We could not accomplish deliverance for the earth,
Nor were inhabitants of the world born.
Isaiah 26:18
The reason was, because they had not obeyed,
depended on,
or loved their God.
Sin and unbelief, do not bring forth life,
and certainly not a joy filled happy godly life.
Neither the wicked,
or even the believers,
can be truly happy when sin is pregnant.
You gain 'labor pains', and reap the wind.
But now Isaiah changes gears so to speak:
Your dead will live; Their corpses will rise.
You who lie in the dust, awake and shout for joy,
For your dew is as the dew of the dawn,
And the earth will give birth to the departed spirits.
Isaiah 26:19
There is going to be a resurrection of the godly.
And I think, the restoration of Israel,
is most likely, the main focus here.
‘I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’?
He is not the God of the dead but of the living.”
Matthew 22:32
But of course, in the future all will rise
some to ever lasting life,
and some to be judged and to spend eternity in Hell.
For you have died and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
Colossians 3:3
and
And not only this,
but also we ourselves,
having the first fruits of the Spirit,
even we ourselves groan within ourselves,
waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons,
the redemption of our body.
Romans 8:23
Also
whom heaven must receive until the period of restoration
of all things about which God spoke
by the mouth of His holy prophets from ancient time.
Acts 3:21
In this restoration of Israel the people will shout for joy.
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Oct 2, 2023 11:15:01 GMT -5
 I honestly didn't realize I was posting that in your Bible study thread. I"m so sorry! I'm glad it helped you somehow, but sorry I posted it in the wrong place. Just let me know if you want me to move it ok? Since I already posted it here, I might as well reply to it here too lol
Coughing can be part of it. There's another article she wrote about strange or weird symptoms of RA and LOTS of people replied telling about their strangest symptoms. It was sure an eye opener! It made me realize I wasn't the only strange one LOL. That you have nodules on your back or that they're close to your neck, has nothing to do with why it would attack your voice hon. It attacks mine a number of times every year. Sometimes just for a day, or for a week or a month. Sometimes I cant talk hardly at all, other times I can only squeak, and yes, I'm constantly coughing before I attempt to talk especially, trying to clear my throat I guess. All I've ever been able to do though, was wait until it stopped messing with my voice and I could talk again. I don't know if taking medication for RA would help it or not, because I don't take anything for it.
Here are some other causes of it that may be helpful:
Gastroesophageal reflux (GERD). GERD—commonly called heartburn—can cause hoarseness when stomach acid rises up the throat and irritates the tissues. Usually hoarseness caused by GERD is worse in the morning and improves throughout the day. In some people, the stomach acid rises all the way up to the throat and larynx and irritates the vocal folds. This is called laryngopharyngeal reflux (LPR). LPR can happen during the day or night. Some people will have no heartburn with LPR, but they may feel as if they constantly have to cough to clear their throat and they may become hoarse. GERD and LPR are treated with dietary modifications and medications that reduce stomach acid.
Thyroid problems can cause hoarseness.
The thyroid gland sits in the lower front of the neck below the larynx, which is also known as ‘the voice box’. Low thyroid hormone levels cause fluid to accumulate in the vocal folds, and when the thyroid gland enlarges due to disease, the vocal chords can become pinched or partially paralyzed due to their snug proximity.
Many symptoms of an underactive thyroid (hypothyroidism) are the same as those of other conditions. So an underactive thyroid can easily be confused for something else.
Symptoms usually develop slowly. You may not realise you have a medical problem for several years.
Common symptoms and signs include: hoarseness or deepening of the voice.
Interesting....but then many folks who have RA or Sjögren’s syndrome have GERD and/or thyroid problems.
I did read your studies and enjoyed them. In fact, I was reading about the restoration in Jeremiah today.
Here's some of what I read about it:
“How awful that day will be! None will be like it. It will be a time of trouble for Jacob, but he will be saved out of it. “ ‘In that day,’ declares the LORD Almighty, ‘I will break the yoke off their necks and will tear off their bonds; no longer will foreigners enslave them. Instead, they will serve the LORD their God and David their king, whom I will raise up for them. “ ‘So do not fear, O Jacob my servant; do not be dismayed, O Israel,’ declares the LORD. ‘I will surely save you out of a distant place, your descendants from the land of their exile. Jacob will again have peace and security, and no one will make him afraid. I am with you and will save you,’ declares the LORD. ‘Though I completely destroy all the nations among which I scatter you, I will not completely destroy you. I will discipline you but only with justice; I will not let you go entirely unpunished.’” (Jeremiah 30:7–11)
Daniel said it too: ““At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.” (Daniel 12:1) as did other prophets.
It should make people in our country who aren't saved fear, because if God doesn't destroy us before then we can be sure we will be destroyed along with all the other nations during the Tribulation.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 3, 2023 0:00:15 GMT -5
I am not too worried that we posted here...
Yes I have thyroid disease.
But the squeaky whisper of my voice,
has taken a really extreme presentation for the worse
for the last 6 months or more.
I have halfheartedly
( in other words not exactly..... 'consistently')
tried things like:
a drink with vinegar and water etc.
Gargle with salt water
Drink more water
Take garlic pills
and so on
Sometimes it 'seems' to help
maybe 5-15%
But since that is such a low 'improvement' score
I would be hard pressed to say that any of those things,
'actually' helped.
On the other hand, I don't 'think' they harmed any....
it would be pretty much impossible to make it much worse.
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Post by Cindy on Oct 3, 2023 6:56:10 GMT -5
I'm sorry nothing helps you get rid of it. Hopefully, one of these days it will just go away on it's own. Today it's my turn to not be able to stay awake! I'll have to try again later, hopefully, that's if I remember to! 
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 3, 2023 12:12:44 GMT -5
Well ha...I am super sleepy today also....from coast to coast eh? LOL
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 3, 2023 12:39:29 GMT -5
Come, my people, enter into your rooms
And close your doors behind you;
Hide for a little while Until indignation runs its course.
Isaiah 26:20
For a 'little while', indicates it is going to take time,
it is not instantaneous.
Therefore patient waiting is required.
Actually, in a way,
the message to patiently wait on the Lord,
is good council for all generations.
In fact, 'closing our doors',
or another way of saying seek shelter,
and using that time for prayer,
is also, good advise for all times.
And tho restoration is not going to be instantaneous,
it also will not be super long and drawn out,
but rather for a 'little' while.
But while this 'shelter' indicates a material structure,
I think, we can also apply it
to having a trusting mind and heart,
to what the Lord God is doing.
We can be assured as believers,
that in one way or another,
we will be delivered, by our Lord.
For behold, the Lord is about to come out from His place
To punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity;
And the earth will reveal her bloodshed
And will no longer cover her slain.
Isaiah 26:21
Cruel crimes, that may have been hidden, will some day be revealed.
There will be a final judgment,
so tho it may seem,
the wicked get away with their bloody crimes...
the day is coming when all their ungodly deeds will be exposed.
“Therefore do not fear them,
for there is nothing concealed that will not be revealed,
or hidden that will not be known.
Matthew 10:26
So as believers, even tho it may be hard,
and grievous tempting,
we should not lose heart, and rage....
because even tho, it may 'seem'
the wicked often get away with their crimes,
this is not the end of the story!
Let's wait patiently on the Lord.
If the wicked do not turn and be converted,
then a day of judgment is for sure, coming!
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Oct 4, 2023 10:21:19 GMT -5
 You know what Isaiah 26:20 remind me of? When God promises to protect the Jews for the last half of the Tribulation, probably in Petra! When read in context, it really seems to be speaking of that time: “But your dead will live; their bodies will rise. You who dwell in the dust, wake up and shout for joy. Your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead. Go, my people, enter your rooms and shut the doors behind you; hide yourselves for a little while until his wrath has passed by. See, the LORD is coming out of his dwelling to punish the people of the earth for their sins. The earth will disclose the blood shed upon her; she will conceal her slain no longer.” (Isaiah 26:19–21)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 5, 2023 10:26:34 GMT -5
Oh wow! I did not think of that...but yes, that does sound like it :)
I slept all day yesterday...well, I was up for about 20 minutes and ate a bowl of cereal...before my head almost dropped in the bowl, I went back to sleep.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 5, 2023 11:01:54 GMT -5
In that day the Lord will punish Leviathan the fleeing serpent,
With His fierce and great and mighty sword,
Even Leviathan the twisted serpent;
And He will kill the dragon who lives in the sea.
Isaiah 27:1
Well, I don't think we can say for sure,
but fleeing serpent,
and dragon,
says to me,
the potential of dinosaurs living at the same time,
as people back then, is a possibility.
In any case, men cannot contend with it, only God.
Thus, another possibility is this is symbolic of Satan.
The twisted serpent, does remind us, of Satan's 'twisted' ways.
Tho, Satan does not live in the sea.
Whatever it is, the good news is,
God will kill it, with His great and mighty sword....
in that day.
We go from that 'sort of' scary verse,
to this more joyful one:
In that day, "A vineyard of wine, sing of it!
Isaiah 27:2
Singing is generally a happy state.
And now we know why,
because the Lord is it's keeper!
I, the Lord , am its keeper; I water it every moment.
So that no one will damage it, I guard it night and day.
Isaiah 27:3
I think this vineyard is Israel.
It reminds me of some verses like:
“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser.
John 15:1
and
He who believes in Me, as the Scripture said,
‘From his innermost being will flow rivers of living water.’”
John 7:38
God is its protector and provider.
Done for today.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 7, 2023 11:05:18 GMT -5
"I have no wrath. Should someone give Me briars and thorns in battle,
Then I would step on them, I would burn them completely.
Isaiah 27:4
God anger will cease against Israel,and will destroy her enemies.
"Or let him rely on My protection,
Let him make peace with Me,
Let him make peace with Me."
Isaiah 27:5
Here is an uplifting, hopeful alternative,
they could make peace with God.
God is willing to establish a close relationship with His enemies.
We see how earnestly God desires to be reconciled, by the repetition.
In the days to come Jacob will take root,
Israel will blossom and sprout,
And they will fill the whole world with fruit.
Isaiah 27:6
I think this could refer to Jesus's millennial kingdom.
Then Israel will do what it was always meant to.
The gospel will fill the whole earth.
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Oct 8, 2023 10:29:33 GMT -5
Amen! Yes it does refer to the Millennial Kingdom! I can't wait to see it!
That also reminds me of what Jesus said in the Parable of the Sower:
“Still other seed fell on good soil, where it produced a crop—a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown.” (Matthew 13:8) Israel will finally fulfill the their role of telling others about God and teaching people about Him! “you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”” (Exodus 19:6)
“And you will be called priests of the LORD, you will be named ministers of our God. You will feed on the wealth of nations, and in their riches you will boast.” (Isaiah 61:6)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 9, 2023 11:13:30 GMT -5
Like the striking of Him who has struck them,
has He struck them?
Or like the slaughter of His slain,
have they been slain?
Isaiah 27:7
God has often tempered his punishment of Israel, in that,
God's punishments were never as severe as they could have been.
This is kind of an interesting verse for this very day....
Look at how God dealt with Sodom and Gomorrah,
and yet,
Israel was as bad, if not worse,
nevertheless,
God was more lenient with Israel ( as to their punishment).
He did punish them for their sins to be sure,
however he did not totally destroy them from the face of the earth.
But His compassion for other nations, will come to an end.
What if God, wishing to show his wrath and make known his power,
has endured with much patience
the vessels of wrath made for destruction?
Romans 9:22
( I can't help but think of what is going on in Israel right now).
Those attacking Israel, might want to rethink their actions.
You contended with them by banishing them,
by driving them away.
With His fierce wind He has expelled them on the day of the east wind.
Isaiah 27:8
Generally, for punishment of God's own people Israel,
He sends them into captivity...
But then, after a time,
they can come back to their home land.
This banishing them from their homeland, and sending them away,
is punishment,
but, it is in moderation.
Therefore through this Jacob's iniquity will be forgiven;
And this will be the full price of the pardoning of his sin:
When he makes all the altar stones like pulverized chalk stones;
When Asherim and incense altars will not stand.
Isaiah 27:9
God is willing to forgive Jacob's sin,
but repentance is required...
and what must they repent of?
Idolatry and idols.
They have to acknowledge their sins and repent...
However, it is ONLY Jesus who can truly pay for their sins.
Nevertheless, we have many idols worshiped today.
They may not be made of stone...
( tho I suppose statues of Buddha,
and many other such physical idols do still exist).
We have so many other idols, it would be impossible to name them all!
Of course, now as then,
'self' and pride in ourselves,
is right up there near the top of the list.
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Post by Cindy on Oct 10, 2023 6:40:07 GMT -5
Very True. Look how long God kept them out of their home after they didn't recognize Jesus as their Messiah though! From 70ad to 1948! Almost 2000 years! And even today all of them haven't returned. Some of them have decided they're comfortable right where they are and don't plan to leave. So God will make sure they aren't comfortable anymore and force them to leave when the judgments begin coming down. That happened after their time in Babylon was over too. Now they're just dry bones, there's no life in them yet as most don't acknowledge Jesus as their Savior. That will all change when
God removes their heart of stone and gives them a heart of flesh. He starts to tell us about this with these verses and the rest of the chapter: “Then he said to me, “Prophesy to these bones and say to them, ‘Dry bones, hear the word of the LORD! This is what the Sovereign LORD says to these bones: I will make breath enter you, and you will come to life.” (Ezekiel 37:4–5)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 10, 2023 11:26:11 GMT -5
Great point Cindy. About their coming back to Israel, I just read, where many are making flights now, to come back, and fight for the very existence (potentially) of Israel.. as they see it. This war, (as they see it) is a do or die war. We know they will continue to exist, as God has said so, but this is a major escalation and seems to be another big big piece in moving us closer to the very end times.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 11, 2023 10:54:41 GMT -5
For the fortified city is isolated,
A homestead forlorn and forsaken like the desert;
There the calf will graze,
And there it will lie down and feed on its branches.
Isaiah 27:10
Due to rampant wickedness,God will eventually destroy this rebellious, sinful world.
Which city this refers to, is not stated,
but there are many candidates that could be offered.
I think we are seeing wickedness,
growing by leaps and bounds, in our day.
God patience and mercy will come to and end,
for those who only want evil and wickedness.
When its limbs are dry, they are broken off;
Women come and make a fire with them,
For they are not a people of discernment,
Therefore their Maker will not have compassion on them.
And their Creator will not be gracious to them.
Isaiah 27:11
From the beginning, Israel was God's chosen people,
and although they sinned,
and He punished them
( sometimes very severely),
He continued to have compassion on them.
Not so with Israel's enemies.
In that day the Lord
will start His threshing
from the flowing stream of the Euphrates to the brook of Egypt,
and you will be gathered up one by one, O sons of Israel.
Isaiah 27:12
The faithful Jews will be gathered back to their land.
It seems that they are not gathered in huge groups,
perhaps, because He is only gathering the 'faithful',
so thus it is one by one....
and not a ton by a ton.
And to worship God is the main goal!
It will come about also
in that day
that a great trumpet will be blown,
and those who were perishing in the land of Assyria
and who were scattered in the land of Egypt
will come and worship the Lord
in the holy mountain at Jerusalem.
Isaiah 27:13
After God collects His scattered people,
from the nations,
which while they were there, they were perishing,
( in some cases near destruction)....
They again will worship God!
Somehow this seems 'timely' to me,
considering what is going on in Israel this very day.
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Post by Cindy on Oct 12, 2023 9:41:42 GMT -5
Great point Cindy. About their coming back to Israel, I just read, where many are making flights now, to come back, and fight for the very existence (potentially) of Israel.. as they see it. This war, (as they see it) is a do or die war. We know they will continue to exist, as God has said so, but this is a major escalation and seems to be another big big piece in moving us closer to the very end times. |
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 12, 2023 15:00:36 GMT -5
You are right, it is still, 'mostly' a secular' nation, but thank the good Lord, that will change, in the future!
Thank you so much for your comments, they are so encouraging.
I guess that is one reason why God said, believers need each other. :)
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Post by Cindy on Oct 13, 2023 10:58:11 GMT -5
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 13, 2023 11:24:13 GMT -5
Oh NO!
LOL
That looks suspiciously like a 'group hug'!!!
Both Devon and Vanessa are 'big' group huggers...
I am always trying to sneak away, but they find me every time for a group hug.
Wed. Devon first 'snaggled' all the older men,
in the NCFF moring Bible study for a group hug.
Then at night, we went to Calvary from Pastor Chris's Bible study...
and he snared a bunch more, including Pastor Chris.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 13, 2023 18:25:19 GMT -5
Woe to the proud crown of the drunkards of Ephraim,
And to the fading flower of its glorious beauty,
Which is at the head of the fertile valley
Of those who are overcome with wine!
Isaiah 28:1
Woe: is never a positive, upbeat, happy word!
The leaders seem to be drunkards.
This could be a warning for our country today....
the Bible is NOT outdated!
While many leaders then, as now ,
seem to live only to enjoy themselves,
without much care about the welfare of the people....
Disaster may be right around the corner.
We in this country are busy fussing about things like:
can we say there are only 2 sexes or are there 1000 genders
and what is the right pronoun...
etc.
Meanwhile, the Middle East is blowing up!
And do we not think it could come to our door step?
Once, we too, were a glorious beauty,
but now, a fading flower.
Behold, the Lord has a strong and mighty agent;
As a storm of hail, a tempest of destruction,
Like a storm of mighty overflowing waters,
He has cast it down to the earth with His hand.
Isaiah 28:2
These figures of speech are to awaken people to an invading army.
( in this case the Assyrian army).
It makes me think of how easy it is to push down to the ground
a completely and totally drunk person
( who can barely stand up anyway)...
so what about the USA today,
with millions of citizens on all manner of drugs,
and having sex 'changes/mutilations'
and arguing about 'words'.....
that they are so upsetting to folks,
that the youth need to go to their safe spaces,
and blow bubbles?
While in Israel today, babies were beheaded and/or burned to death!
We need to wake up and throw ourselves on the mercy of God.
Yup drunk
The proud crown of the drunkards of Ephraim is trodden under foot.
Isaiah 28:3
What a sad description...
They were seeking drunken and intoxicated, mirth, merriment, and pleasure,
while they were about to be devoured by their enemies!
Is there a chance that we too in our country are mimicking very similar behaviors.
Are we under God's judgment also?
It seems to be that the general public, then, as now,
that people are oblivious to impending doom.
When we should be praying....
we are fighting over:
words,
football teams,
can a man have a baby,
are people with less melanin.... privilege, and incurable racists?
etc. etc. etc.
Not aware that the judgment of God is nearing...
No, instead, they think and say:
They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised?
Ever since our ancestors died,
everything goes on
as it has
since the beginning of creation.
2 Peter 3:4
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Post by oliverwithatwist on Oct 13, 2023 19:41:30 GMT -5
Agree with everything you said in above post.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 14, 2023 8:16:39 GMT -5
Thank You "Oliverwithatwist'!!! I was afraid, I was a 'little too'..... angry..... myself...
and sad!
But I have to keep reminding myself.....
God is able!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 16, 2023 11:54:12 GMT -5
And the fading flower of its glorious beauty,
Which is at the head of the fertile valley,
Will be like the first-ripe fig prior to summer,
Which one sees, And as soon as it is in his hand, He swallows it.
Isaiah 28:4
They ( the Assyrian army) will seize
the rich prey,
symbolized
( or as a metaphor)
as, the first ripe fig (Ephriam)
without any or much resistance...
and that is a result of bad leadership,
in part,
because they are heavy wine-drinkers.
So these short-lived fruits,
that would not yield to the continual nourishment from God,
are greedily gobbled up by their enemy.
In that day the Lord of hosts will become a beautiful crown
And a glorious diadem to the remnant of His people;
Isaiah 28:5
Instead of the arrogant, proud, drunken crown wearers,
corrupted by all manner of crimes...
The 'True' crown will replace the frauds.
God still has compassion.
The world's rulers,
are often like the fading flowers,
which soon wither and decay.
But not so, is God!
This reminds me of the 'culture' of many nations today.
We are seeing all types and manifestations,
of the forces of evil,
growing in leaps and bounds...
and how quickly we are sliding into this:
As it was in the days of Noah,
so it will be in the days of the Son of Man
Luke 17:26
Plus, this reminds me that Jesus reign is coming,
and justice will prevail in the world.
( after the rapture, and the 7 year tribulation):
A spirit of justice for him who sits in judgment,
A strength to those who repel the onslaught at the gate.
Isaiah 28:6
Done for Today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 18, 2023 10:05:29 GMT -5
And these also reel with wine and stagger from strong drink:
The priest and the prophet reel with strong drink,
They are confused by wine,
they stagger from strong drink;
They reel while having visions,
They totter when rendering judgment.
Isaiah 28:7
Even the religious leaders are infected with drunkenness,
and they have false spiritual visions, making them unfit to lead...
and they gave false guidance.
But not only that,
there was this grossness:
For all the tables are full of filthy vomit,
without a single clean place.
Isaiah 28:8
They wallowed in disgusting and revolting filth of their vomit.
Since the rulers have plummeted to such shameful depths,
what chance is there for the nation?
This sort of reminds me of the 1st time ever
the white house,
of the USA
had drugs found in it
( a few months ago).
"To whom would He teach knowledge,
And to whom would He interpret the message?
Those just weaned from milk?
Those just taken from the breast?
Isaiah 28:9
Isaiah now mocks these falling down drunken leaders...
who are totally disqualified to instruct others.
Their silly drunken visions
are like teaching babies their ABC's
only...
at least that, ( the ABC's) would be true!
Instead, these drunks treated the people as children,
with an endless repetition of the same elementary instruction,
which resulted in contempt.
Another way of looking at it is that,
their drunken teachings were incoherent,
and resembled the talk of children.
Kind of reminds me of today,
when some of the
'big and important'
issues of our time,
by our leaders...
seem to be:
can a biological man
have a baby and breast feed it?
Done for Today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,395
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Post by fearnot on Oct 20, 2023 8:41:16 GMT -5
Now the drunken leaders mock Isaiah:
For it is precept upon precept,
precept upon precept,
line upon line,
line upon line,
here a little,
there a little.”
Isaiah 28:10
Mocking the careful teaching of the foundation
of scripture.
These drunken leaders are tired of hearing Isaiah's
same simple message over and over
( could it be Isaiah does that because,
they are half sheets to the wind, drunk,
and cannot even understand the basics?)
But actually,
I think,
even for the Christian today,
this is a good way to learn God's word.
Indeed, He will speak to this people
Through stammering lips and a foreign tongue,
Isaiah 28:11
Isaiah replies:
Since they think the way Isaiah teaches is humiliating,
and thus they refuse to listen to his ( God's) precise and clear words....
then God will speak to them and give them instruction,
in a different language....
one that they will certainly not understand....
the foreign language of the Assyrians.
He who said to them,
"Here is rest, give rest to the weary,"
And, "Here is repose,"
but they would not listen.
Isaiah 28:12
God had warned them of the approaching calamities
they could have rest and peace
( so often repeated)
in Him (God),
but they rebelliously rejected this doctrine with mockery.
Jesus said:
Come to me,
all who labor and are heavy laden,
and I will give you rest.
Matthew 11:28
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Oct 20, 2023 13:32:39 GMT -5
Oh NO!
LOL
That looks suspiciously like a 'group hug'!!!
Both Devon and Vanessa are 'big' group huggers...
I am always trying to sneak away, but they find me every time for a group hug.
Wed. Devon first 'snaggled' all the older men,
in the NCFF moring Bible study for a group hug.
Then at night, we went to Calvary from Pastor Chris's Bible study...
and he snared a bunch more, including Pastor Chris.
 If I'd been there, I'm sure I would have been just about to fall over because I'd be laughing so hard! Devon sure understands about loving everyone!  I loved the studies you've done in my absence! You're doing a very good job! Thank you!
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I honestly didn't realize I was posting that in your Bible study thread. I"m so sorry! I'm glad it helped you somehow, but sorry I posted it in the wrong place. Just let me know if you want me to move it ok? Since I already posted it here, I might as well reply to it here too lol
You know what Isaiah 26:20 remind me of? When God promises to protect the Jews for the last half of the Tribulation, probably in Petra! When read in context, it really seems to be speaking of that time: “But your dead will live; their bodies will rise. You who dwell in the dust, wake up and shout for joy. Your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead. Go, my people, enter your rooms and shut the doors behind you; hide yourselves for a little while until his wrath has passed by. See, the LORD is coming out of his dwelling to punish the people of the earth for their sins. The earth will disclose the blood shed upon her; she will conceal her slain no longer.” (Isaiah 26:19–21) 
If I'd been there, I'm sure I would have been just about to fall over because I'd be laughing so hard! Devon sure understands about loving everyone! 
I loved the studies you've done in my absence! You're doing a very good job! Thank you!
!!
