fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383 
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Post by fearnot on Nov 22, 2021 10:44:43 GMT -5
I should not laugh but the verse
Like a gold ring in a pig’s snout is a beautiful woman who shows no discretion.
(Proverbs 11:22)
Is such a 'colorful' word painting.
But it really gets the point across!
After looking at Isaac and Jacob,
are there any others we should look at that you can think of?
Or should we move onto another topic?
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 22, 2021 12:33:11 GMT -5
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
Today a bit more about Isaac as a bad father.
Playing favorites with your children often leads to sibling rivalry,
becoming bitter enemies,
( which in some cases can be close to... or even deadly).
And so we read this about Isaac:
Isaac, who had a taste for wild game, loved Esau,
but Rebekah loved Jacob.
Genesis 25:28
It could be Isaac somehow related better to Esau manly hunting pursuits,
whereas Jacob may have been more a 'mommy's boy,
staying at home, perhaps more scholarly?
The boys grew up, and Esau became a skillful hunter,
a man of the open country,
while Jacob was content to stay at home among the tents.
Genesis 25:27
Nevertheless while it may be easier to get along with one child,
because of your shared interests,
but the pain it causes another child,
ought to help a parent, take great care, to love each child,
and note them for their special but different talents,
and equally discipline .
I may be over reaching here, but I wonder if
somehow the problem started even before the twin sons were born?
Rebekah was told by God, this:
23 The Lord said to her
“Two nations are in your womb,
and two peoples from within you will be separated;
one people will be stronger than the other,
and the older will serve the younger.”
Genesis 25:23
I would think that surely Rebekah told Isaac what God said-
maybe Isaac, even heard it also.
yet, Isaac determined to give Esau
the birthright as was the custom of those days
( the eldest almost always...and Esau was a few minutes older).
Isaac seemed to continue to overrule God's decision
that Jacob would get the birthright,
and to put his own 'feelings' of love for Esau,
ahead of his love for God.
He ignores the fact that Esau is not qualified,
and he decides to give the blessing in secret.
But Isaac is not the only sneaky one in this family.
4 Prepare me the kind of tasty food I like
and bring it to me to eat,
so that I may give you my blessing before I die.”
5 Now Rebekah was listening as Isaac spoke to his son Esau.
Genesis 27:4,5
No one in this family,
seems to have any moral or spiritual objections to lying, deceiving etc.
Neither parent, neither son.
All seem to be under the impression, that they maybe are even 'helping' God,
So a little 'white' lie,
a 'little' cheating etc...
well God would understand.
After all if the promised end is the result,
the means of getting there, is not so important.
Of course all of the excuses are wrong, and sin will have consequences.
Jacob will indeed win this contest of deception, but he is going to be paying a heavy price.
If only he and his mom had waited and left it up to God,
and
This lying, sneaky, secrecy, conniving way of getting your own way,
continued on to the children and grandchildren.
So you might think, having lived with this over the top display of parental 'favoritism'
that Jacob would do all he could, not to repeat the same mistake with his children...
but you would be wrong.
Tomorrow I will look at Jacob as a bad father.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 23, 2021 13:01:59 GMT -5
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
Today, I will look at Jacob as a bad father.
Like his father Isaac, Jacob played 'favoritism' with his 12 sons,
preferring Joseph, to the other 10 sons
( he also would show similar favoritism to
Benjamin later on)
Jacob is called, both Jacob and Israel in scripture.
But Israel/Jacob would do things like this for Joseph alone,
(that only increased the sibling rivalry
and incensed and enraged his half brothers) .
Now Israel loved Joseph more than all his sons,
because he was the son of his old age;
and he made him a varicolored tunic
( maybe even like what royalty would wear,
it certainly was not plain and utilitarian) .
Genesis 37:3
I don't recall Israel/Jacob doing anything
super special, and overly indulgent,
like this special coat, for his other sons.
Which is sort of mind boggling when you
consider, that Jacob lived himself as a child
of extreme sibling rivalry.
But rather than learning the dangers of favoring one son above the others
he just copied what his parents had done with he and Esau.
This coat may have been even more symbolic,
perhaps a symbol that Jacob would chose Joseph to be the head of the clan?
In any case, it added to his brothers hating him with a vengeance,
with some wanting to kill Joseph outright,
until they decided they could sell him into slavery,
and make a tidy profit off of him.
and since Jacob was no stranger to deception
deception and lies comes home to roust,
when his sons lie to him.
31 So they took Joseph’s tunic,
and slaughtered a male goat and dipped the tunic in the blood;
32 and they sent the varicolored tunic and brought it to their father and said,
“We found this; please examine it to see whether it is your son’s tunic or not.”
33 Then he examined it and said, “It is my son’s tunic.
A wild beast has devoured him;
Joseph has surely been torn to pieces!”
34 So Jacob tore his clothes,
and put sackcloth on his loins and mourned for his son many days.
35 Then all his sons and all his daughters arose to comfort him,
but he refused to be comforted.
And he said, “Surely I will go down to Sheol in mourning for my son.”
So his father wept for him.
Genesis 37:31-35
And his reaction and response
to his daughter Dinah's being raped,was:
silence
When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite,
the prince of the land, saw her,
he took her and lay with her by force
Genesis 34:2
And
5 Now Jacob heard that he had defiled Dinah his daughter;
but his sons were with his livestock in the field,
so Jacob kept silent until they came in.
Genesis 34:5
He does not seem to be decisiveness,
nor oddly we don't hear of him tearing his clothes
( like he will for Joseph being 'supposedly' killed)
Is this another example of his favoritism?
Maybe his daughter was even be on the lowest rung,
of his caring for his children?
And his response when his son take revenge and kill all the men of Shechem?
A good talking to:
that in a way,
seemed to me, to be more about fear and self-centeredness):
Then Jacob said to Simeon and Levi,
“You have brought trouble on me
by making me odious among the inhabitants of the land,
among the Canaanites and the Perizzites;
and my men being few in number,
they will gather together against me
and attack me and I will be destroyed,
I and my household.”
31 But they said, “Should he treat our sister as a harlot?”
Genesis 34:30,31
Jacob seemed to respond more or less the same when:
It came about while Israel was dwelling in that land,
that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father’s concubine,
and Israel heard of it.
Genesis 35:22
it appears Jacob may have done nothing or even said nothing about this.
Again, this is not how a good father would deal with this kind sin of sexual immorality.
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Post by Cindy on Nov 23, 2021 13:16:22 GMT -5
I should not laugh but the verse
Like a gold ring in a pig’s snout is a beautiful woman who shows no discretion.
(Proverbs 11:22)
Is such a 'colorful' word painting.
But it really gets the point across!
After looking at Isaac and Jacob,
are there any others we should look at that you can think of?
Or should we move onto another topic?
 Don't ask me lol, it's up to you when we go to another topic. But I was looking through my notes and saw this quote: "God has this remarkable and miraculous way of taking what people mean for harm and turning it into something good. So even though Joseph had to survive a pit, a prison, and someone else’s nagging wife, he eventually ended up second only to Pharaoh in all of Egypt." No Other Gods This made me think of the many people in the Bible who loved God and trusted Him, but had very hard lives with things we would consider bad happening to them over and over for no apparent reason since they did their best to obey Him. (Like Joseph) That of course reminded me of all that Eva's been saying. So I think we should do a study showing many of the people who loved and obeyed God, but had some very hard lives. What do you think?
Another good one. It's up to you when we start the new topic. I want to get in on the new one when I can too. |
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 23, 2021 13:38:52 GMT -5
Do you want to start one here? Feel free :)
The one for today is above your post for today.
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Post by Cindy on Nov 24, 2021 13:16:01 GMT -5
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
Today, I will look at Jacob as a bad father.
Like his father Isaac, Jacob played 'favoritism' with his 12 sons,
preferring Joseph, to the other 10 sons
( he also would show similar favoritism to
Benjamin later on)
Jacob is called, both Jacob and Israel in scripture.
But Israel/Jacob would do things like this for Joseph alone,
(that only increased the sibling rivalry
and incensed and enraged his half brothers) .
Now Israel loved Joseph more than all his sons,
because he was the son of his old age;
and he made him a varicolored tunic
( maybe even like what royalty would wear,
it certainly was not plain and utilitarian) .
Genesis 37:3
I don't recall Israel/Jacob doing anything
super special, and overly indulgent,
like this special coat, for his other sons.
Which is sort of mind boggling when you
consider, that Jacob lived himself as a child
of extreme sibling rivalry.
But rather than learning the dangers of favoring one son above the others
he just copied what his parents had done with he and Esau.
This coat may have been even more symbolic,
perhaps a symbol that Jacob would chose Joseph to be the head of the clan?
In any case, it added to his brothers hating him with a vengeance,
with some wanting to kill Joseph outright,
until they decided they could sell him into slavery,
and make a tidy profit off of him.
and since Jacob was no stranger to deception
deception and lies comes home to roust,
when his sons lie to him.
31 So they took Joseph’s tunic,
and slaughtered a male goat and dipped the tunic in the blood;
32 and they sent the varicolored tunic and brought it to their father and said,
“We found this; please examine it to see whether it is your son’s tunic or not.”
33 Then he examined it and said, “It is my son’s tunic.
A wild beast has devoured him;
Joseph has surely been torn to pieces!”
34 So Jacob tore his clothes,
and put sackcloth on his loins and mourned for his son many days.
35 Then all his sons and all his daughters arose to comfort him,
but he refused to be comforted.
And he said, “Surely I will go down to Sheol in mourning for my son.”
So his father wept for him.
Genesis 37:31-35
And his reaction and response
to his daughter Dinah's being raped,was:
silence
When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite,
the prince of the land, saw her,
he took her and lay with her by force
Genesis 34:2
And
5 Now Jacob heard that he had defiled Dinah his daughter;
but his sons were with his livestock in the field,
so Jacob kept silent until they came in.
Genesis 34:5
He does not seem to be decisiveness,
nor oddly we don't hear of him tearing his clothes
( like he will for Joseph being 'supposedly' killed)
Is this another example of his favoritism?
Maybe his daughter was even be on the lowest rung,
of his caring for his children?
And his response when his son take revenge and kill all the men of Shechem?
A good talking to:
that in a way,
seemed to me, to be more about fear and self-centeredness):
Then Jacob said to Simeon and Levi,
“You have brought trouble on me
by making me odious among the inhabitants of the land,
among the Canaanites and the Perizzites;
and my men being few in number,
they will gather together against me
and attack me and I will be destroyed,
I and my household.”
31 But they said, “Should he treat our sister as a harlot?”
Genesis 34:30,31
Jacob seemed to respond more or less the same when:
It came about while Israel was dwelling in that land,
that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father’s concubine,
and Israel heard of it.
Genesis 35:22
it appears Jacob may have done nothing or even said nothing about this.
Again, this is not how a good father would deal with this kind sin of sexual immorality.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 24, 2021 13:47:11 GMT -5
it is often hard to wrap our minds around the fact, that being held accountable and being disciplined can actually make a child feel loved and cared about.
I 'think' children often up their rebellion, just to try and get their parents attention.
I know I felt to punish a child was somehow 'cruel' and they would hate me.
But not only did I kind of naturally think and feel that....
The culture is constantly bombarding parents
( and sometimes even taking children away
if they 'spank' their child....
even a one time swat on the rump is considered 'physical abuse'
and we are warned, children will learn to be violent because of that.
Perhaps to some extent that could be true....if the parent was truly abusing their children physically ( broken bones, bruises etc.)
And there are other ways to discipline.....
taking favorite toys, computers etc away for a time
etc.
But some in the secular world would not even allow those things, because...again....it is destroying the child's self image etc.
And so between wanting to look good
wanting to be 'loved' by our children
having the secular world always destroying our self image as a parent.....
Many take the 'easy' way out I think.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 24, 2021 14:14:24 GMT -5
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
Then there are some dads in scripture we can think are even beyond 'bad'
evil, but maybe even demonic,
two of such fathers would be:
Ahaz
3 But he walked in the way of the kings of Israel,
and even made his son pass through the fire,
according to the abominations of the nations
whom the Lord had driven out from before the sons of Israel.
2 Kings 16:3
Another who did the same thing was:
Manassah
6 He made his son pass through the fire,
practiced witchcraft and used divination,
and dealt with mediums and spiritists.
He did much evil in the sight of the Lord provoking Him to anger
2 Kings 21:6
He did later repent, but the after those children were sacrificed.
We might be tempted to think, that influence was probably very limited in scope....
and yet, to this very day, we have men paying for their girlfriend's abortions.
Another issue that is true right up to our day is that,
children are often in a home of absentee fathers
but there is real hope nevertheless
For my father and my mother have forsaken me,
but the Lord will take me in
Psalm 27:10
We have God as our father
9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us,
and we respected them;
shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
Hebrews 12:9
and
See how great a love the Father has bestowed on us,
that we would be called children of God;
and such we are.
For this reason the world does not know us,
because it did not know Him.
1 John 3:1
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Nov 27, 2021 11:17:44 GMT -5
it is often hard to wrap our minds around the fact, that being held accountable and being disciplined can actually make a child feel loved and cared about.
I 'think' children often up their rebellion, just to try and get their parents attention.
I know I felt to punish a child was somehow 'cruel' and they would hate me.
But not only did I kind of naturally think and feel that....
The culture is constantly bombarding parents
( and sometimes even taking children away
if they 'spank' their child....
even a one time swat on the rump is considered 'physical abuse'
and we are warned, children will learn to be violent because of that.
Perhaps to some extent that could be true....if the parent was truly abusing their children physically ( broken bones, bruises etc.)
And there are other ways to discipline.....
taking favorite toys, computers etc away for a time
etc.
But some in the secular world would not even allow those things, because...again....it is destroying the child's self image etc.
And so between wanting to look good
wanting to be 'loved' by our children
having the secular world always destroying our self image as a parent.....
Many take the 'easy' way out I think.
Yes, it took Satan a long time to get people to turn away from spanking their children, but he eventually got it done.
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
Then there are some dads in scripture we can think are even beyond 'bad'
evil, but maybe even demonic,
two of such fathers would be:
Ahaz
3 But he walked in the way of the kings of Israel,
and even made his son pass through the fire,
according to the abominations of the nations
whom the Lord had driven out from before the sons of Israel.
2 Kings 16:3
Another who did the same thing was:
Manassah
6 He made his son pass through the fire,
practiced witchcraft and used divination,
and dealt with mediums and spiritists.
He did much evil in the sight of the Lord provoking Him to anger
2 Kings 21:6
He did later repent, but the after those children were sacrificed.
We might be tempted to think, that influence was probably very limited in scope....
and yet, to this very day, we have men paying for their girlfriend's abortions.
Another issue that is true right up to our day is that,
children are often in a home of absentee fathers
but there is real hope nevertheless
For my father and my mother have forsaken me,
but the Lord will take me in
Psalm 27:10
We have God as our father
9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us,
and we respected them;
shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
Hebrews 12:9
and
See how great a love the Father has bestowed on us,
that we would be called children of God;
and such we are.
For this reason the world does not know us,
because it did not know Him.
1 John 3:1
Done for today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 27, 2021 12:58:35 GMT -5
HA-HA that was the done...now it is done. :)
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Don't ask me lol, it's up to you when we go to another topic. But I was looking through my notes and saw this quote: "God has this remarkable and miraculous way of taking what people mean for harm and turning it into something good. So even though Joseph had to survive a pit, a prison, and someone else’s nagging wife, he eventually ended up second only to Pharaoh in all of Egypt." No Other Gods This made me think of the many people in the Bible who loved God and trusted Him, but had very hard lives with things we would consider bad happening to them over and over for no apparent reason since they did their best to obey Him. (Like Joseph) That of course reminded me of all that Eva's been saying. So I think we should do a study showing many of the people who loved and obeyed God, but had some very hard lives. What do you think?
!!
