fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397 
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Post by fearnot on Jun 12, 2023 14:05:45 GMT -5
"All the kings of the nations lie in glory,
Each in his own tomb.
Isaiah 14:18
This is somehow kind of sad. These rich and powerful kings when alive,
sometimes prepared for themselves, or others prepared for them,
often elaborate,magnificent crypts,
adorned with all manner of splendorous,costly, and magnificent items...
and yet...
they are dead,
and cannot 'enjoy' such a garish display,
of what was once ( when they were alive),
their 'supposed' greatness.
Nevertheless, as for the king of Babylon
this was ( or perhaps for the future 'king' of Babylon,
was what was his resting place in death:
But you have been cast out of your tomb Like a rejected branch,
Clothed with the slain
who are pierced with a sword,
Who go down to the stones of the pit Like a trampled corpse.
Isaiah 14:19
A tree branch, was often the means by which a person in the past,
might be hung...
but the Jews did not hang them on a living branch, of a live tree,
rather a dead branch.
This king did not get the fancy magnificent mausoleum.
More than that, he died not in a beautiful robe, or the finest of clothing, but rather in a dirty blood stained outfit!
He was denied the so-called 'honor' and privilege of a tomb...
instead this disgrace.
"You will not be united with them in burial,
Because you have ruined your country,
You have slain your people.
May the offspring of evildoers not be mentioned forever.
Isaiah 14:20
Usually, if possible, even if a king was slain in battle,
they still got a burial, but not this king,
his cruelty was too great.
And so, even his children will not receive honor.
The memory of the righteous is blessed,
But the name of the wicked will rot.
Proverbs 10:7
and
The face of the Lord is against evildoers,
To cut off the memory of them from the earth.
Psalms 34:16
The arrogant pride of evil men,
often have them wanting to pass on their supposed glorious name,
to their offspring,
and that is pretty iffy...
Sometimes, on occasion, their children may continue in power,
but, within a short time, they are forgotten,
what is more often, or more likely to happen is their children do not continue, and are soon forgotten.
Which points out the futility and folly of self-exalting pride.
Pride that in a way, mimics the pride of Satan.
Done for Today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 13, 2023 12:28:59 GMT -5
Prepare for his sons a place of slaughter
Because of the iniquity of their fathers.
They must not arise and take possession of the earth
And fill the face of the world with cities
Isaiah 14:21
I do not think this means they are paying for their fathers sins,
but rather they are facing the consequences of their father's evils.
The Bible says this:
The person who sins will die.
The son will not bear the punishment for the father’s iniquity,
nor will the father bear the punishment for the son’s iniquity;
the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself,
and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself.
Ezekiel 18:20
Also, they most likely would have similar haughty pride,
which should not grow.
Generally, the apple does not fall far from the tree.
Plus:
as it is written,
“There is none righteous,
not even one.
Romans 3:10
In any case, they were not innocent.
Thus, the destruction will extend to the whole dynasty,
at some point in time.
( wicked men, often seem to have a lot of children).
"I will rise up against them,"
declares the Lord of hosts,
"and will cut off from Babylon
name and survivors,
offspring and posterity,"
declares the Lord .
Isaiah 14:22
This is against the King's sons...
They will not be remembered.
"I will also make it a possession
for the hedgehog and swamps of water,
and I will sweep it with the broom of destruction,"
declares the Lord of hosts.
Isaiah 14:23
Eventually, Babylon,
will not be a habitation of men...
God will bring a deluge.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 14, 2023 11:29:19 GMT -5
I like what you said about Isaiah 14:21, that it doesn't mean they're paying for their father's sins, but instead are having to deal with the consequences of his sins. That's so true! God never judges a child for their parents sins, but He will judge them if they copy the sin of their parents. Parents have a huge influence on their children; an influence for good or bad. For those who aren't saved, their sin nature will often cause them to wind up leading their children into the same sins they partake of. That can happen to the saved to, but in general, those who are saved tend to lead their children toward the Lord, and show them how much God hates sin, and how destructive sin is for the person doing it as well as for others it touches.
I've noticed too how lately God is showing me more and more about how very destructive sin is. We tend to think that if we sin, such as telling a lie, that once we confess it and repent of it, that it's gone and doesn't exist anymore. I wish that was true, but it's not. That one little lie can affect many people, and even when the lie is no longer affecting anyone, it's still here, and affects the earth itself. Every sin that's happened since the Noah's ark found land, is still here corrupting the earth. Remember the first murder and what God said about it in Gen 4:10? You can sense it in the moral decay we see in every country, and in the decay of the earth itself. We see that in the way so many diseases have returned, and the way the weather has brought trials and terror more often, and so on. Maybe you can think of other verses that speak about this..... My brain isn't working at full strength lol
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 14, 2023 15:00:31 GMT -5
Those were such great observations Cindy!!!! Thank you so much:
I liked this, what you wrote very much:
"He will judge them if they copy the sin of their parents.
Parents have a huge influence on their children;
an influence for good or bad.
For those who aren't saved,
their sin nature will often cause them to wind up
leading their children into the same sins they partake of".
And I had never thought about the sins we commit,
even once confessed,
are still affecting the 'earth', world, society etc.
And yet, in a way,
I have...
in that,
I have from time to time
reflected on my 'most' sinful time of life...
in the 60's...
and just had a spiritual burden,
thinking that, those years,
did in fact..
( those confessed and asked for forgiveness)
were having an effect,
in the world to this 'very' day!
And related to that thought is
another problem with sin...
which is....
it isn't 'JUST' the sins committed way then...
that are around today....
BUT
that sin 'grows'....
it grows worse and worse, and worse.
That's why ( I think)
even IF......
a person could have only had one sin in their whole life
( that of course is impossible, we often have 'many, many' every single day)
But just as an example....
if that ONE sin was not confessed, and forgiven, and paid for, by Jesus
then in eternity future.....
It would not be just that exact same so-called 'little' sin
( maybe it was only even a single sinful 'thought' and not acted upon)
that sin would grow and grow throughout 'forever and forever'..
and that is why,
that person with the (hypothetical),
only one sin
could not be in Heaven,
if they were not trusting in Jesus,
and born again.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 14, 2023 16:28:38 GMT -5
The Lord of hosts has sworn saying,
"Surely, just as I have intended so it has happened,
and just as I have planned so it will stand,
Isaiah 14:24
I think it is important to note, that this is a truism,
not just concerning this one thing,
but is true for everything.
Whatever God plans will happen!
It may not happen immediately...
in fact, in some instances, it could even be millenniums
( which is so long in the human sense of 'time'
but not for God).
God's promises tho, never fail.
For I the LORD will speak,
and whatever word I speak will be performed...
Ezekiel 12:25
and
Not one of the good promises which the Lord had made
to the house of Israel failed;
all came to pass
Joshua 21:45
In this particular case,
God is going to judge human pride and arrogance,
and more specifically....
to break Assyria in My land,
and I will trample him on My mountains.
Then his yoke will be removed from them
and his burden removed from their shoulder.
Isaiah 14:25
In Isaiah’s day, perhaps,the immediate threat came not from Babylon,
but from Assyria.
However, they both would suffer the same outcome.
Not only that, but...
This is the plan devised against the whole earth;
and this is the hand that is stretched out against all the nations.
Isaiah 14:26
I am thinking, on the one hand,
those two nations, (more or less),
consisted of what would be considered the whole world...
and on the other hand,
I wonder if this is not a far future prediction...
because in fact, every person in the whole world is a sinner...
and during the tribulation,
the whole world will be under judgment.
Which brings this verse to mind:
And another angel, a second one, followed, saying,
“Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great,
she who has made all the nations
drink of the wine of the passion of her immorality.
Revelation 14:8
We are reminded again,
that what God says will happen,
God cannot lie.
For the Lord of hosts has planned,
and who can frustrate it?
And as for His stretched-out hand, who can turn it back?
Isaiah 14:27
Sometimes, from man's perspective,
it seems almost completely impossible,
for God's Word to actually come true and happen!
Nevertheless, no power can resist or defeat His purposes,
no matter how many there might be or seemingly powerful.
The counsel of the Lord stands forever,
The plans of His heart from generation to generation.
Psalms 33:11
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 15, 2023 11:13:58 GMT -5
 Very well said!
Yes, sin does grow and it also contaminates everything and everyone it touches. Even worse perhaps is that it's also contagious. The Bible says that sin is insanity, and that sinners are fools. The more I've really thought about it, the more I realize how true that is.
When you read the “tests” for leprosy described in Leviticus 13, you can see how the disease is a picture of sin. Like sin, leprosy is deeper than the skin (Lev. 13:3); it spreads (Lev. 13:5–8); it defiles and isolates (Lev. 13:44–46); and it renders things fit only for the fire (Lev. 13:47–59). Anyone who has never trusted the Saviour is spiritually in worse shape than the man Jesus cured from Leprosy in Mark 1:40–45. The Bible exposition commentary.
Speaking of the Lev 13, other commentaries says:
This extended section on leprosy is important because in the Scriptures leprosy frequently symbolizes sin (cf. Ps. 38:3–8; Is. 1:6). The repulsive features of sin are vividly illustrated in leprosy:
(1) Leprosy portrays the internal nature of sin (cf. James 1:14).
(2) Leprosy is a loathsome disease, showing the exceeding despicableness of sin (cf. Rom. 7:13).
(3) Leprosy isolates someone both from society and from the services of the sanctuary, just as sin separates a man from the presence of God (cf. Is. 59:2; Rev. 21:27).
(4) Leprosy, like sin, is an illness that grows progressively worse (cf. James 1:15).
(5) Leprosy is considered to be a contagious disease (cf. vv. 45, 46, note); sin is also contagious in that when the clean and the unclean come together, the unclean invariably contaminates the clean. Believer’s Study Bible
Leprosy is analogous to sin in its insidious growth, difficulty of removal, and association with decay. The Open Bible
Leviticus 13 teaches that leprosy begins beneath the surface of the skin—just as sin does. What you see outwardly in people’s lives is only the result of what is going on within them. We are not sinners because we sin. We sin because we’re sinners. Leviticus 13 goes on to say that leprosy, like sin, spreads throughout the body. Like sin, one could control it for a season. But if he didn’t destroy it, it would eventually destroy him. Jon Courson’s Application Commentary
From: Jer 2:1–37. Sin is no triviality. It is something deep and dark and terrible. It is a betrayal of God’s love. It is spiritual adultery. There is a dynamic connection between sin and judgment. They are two sides of the same coin, two parts of a single process. Rebellion against the sovereign will of God will result in inevitable retribution. Idolatry is absurdity. It is leaving the true God of grace and glory for “gods” which have no real existence and can give no assistance. It is forsaking the fountain of fresh, ever-flowing, life-giving water to hew out, at great expenditure of energy and effort, cracked cisterns which can hold no water. It leads to a tragic fragmentation and disintegration of life. While men, in their folly, are seeking substitutes for the God they have left, as they must and do—whether pleasure, possessions, position, power, education, scientism, formalism in religion, or something else—God is like a lovely fountain at the head of a valley, amid flowers, shrubs, and trees. The way to the fountain is open. There is no charge of admission. The water is sufficient, and it satisfies. The invitation is extended: “Come, every one who thirsts, come to the waters!” (cf. Isa 55:1; Rev. 22:17). The teacher's Bible commentary
The more I've learned about sin, the more horrible I realize it is, and the more I understand what a blessing it was that God cast man out of the garden when he sinned and didn't allow them access to the Tree of Life. The idea of having to live for eternity in a body and mind contaminated with sin is just appalling to me. It's also made me realize the horror that Jesus had to go through on the cross for us in order to pay for our sins! How could I purposely commit another sin, knowing what it cost Him?
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 15, 2023 12:11:01 GMT -5
That was wonderful information!
Thank you so much!!!
The leprosy symbolism was so illuminating!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 15, 2023 12:38:30 GMT -5
In the year that King Ahaz died
this oracle came
Isaiah 14:28
This is the start of a new subject.
The prophet moves from the Babylonians, to the Philistines.
"Do not rejoice, O Philistia, all of you,
Because the rod that struck you is broken;
For from the serpent's root a viper will come out,
And its fruit will be a flying serpent.
Isaiah 14:29
So it seems, worse things are coming...
and thus, Isaiah warns Philistia against being foolishly optimistic.
Really, many people today, get either optimistic,
or depressed and defeated, with a change in power.
However, it is always God who is truly in power...
Therefore our trust should be in the Lord.
Ahaz's dying,
did not necessarily mean,
an invasion would now be a walk in the park.
It was more vain, groundless, proud confidence
of the puffed up Philistines.
Instead, the Jews would have more power than ever!
In fact, this is to comfort the Jews:
Those who are most helpless will eat,
And the needy will lie down in security;
I will destroy your root with famine,
And it will kill off your survivors.
Isaiah 14:30
The poor Jews, will be fed and safe,
and God is going to destroy the Philistines.
Done for today
( super tired :(
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Post by Cindy on Jun 16, 2023 11:09:28 GMT -5
You're so sweet to always encourage me when I write something.  I really enjoy reading what you write too, as you often give me something new to chew on for awhile. I have lots of notes in my Bible that start with, "Barbara said...."  I hope you're able to get some sleep soon hon. 
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 16, 2023 11:36:25 GMT -5
I really do mean it! You give me so much extra info ( deeper dive into the Word of God).
to get to know my Lord and Savior better!
I really do thank you:)
Well part of what is going on is daughter's 50th birthday ( Sunday....they are going to a resort but have family and friends coming, but not us because that would be a bit tooooo much)...
combined with Devon out of school
and
2 of Brian's children, just came for the summer
( along with
Vanessa and boyfriend Ian, showing up yesterday)
So the day,
before I spent approx 2 hours cleaning Devon's room,
so Vanessa did not have to live in a garbage can like Oscar the grouch....
Devon has many many fine qualities
but so far...
neat and tidy is NOT yet one of them!!!
So that was exhausting,
then
I worked in the postage stamp size garden for about 1 1/2 hours
(more tiredness)
Then all the teens arrived and chatted for a time....
and on it went.
I am not used to such rumpus being a couch potato!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 16, 2023 17:29:07 GMT -5
Wail, O gate;
cry, O city;
Melt away, O Philistia, all of you;
For smoke comes from the north,
And there is no straggler in his ranks.
Isaiah 14:31
The smoke ( or cloud of dust) is by the army marching,
thus they will cry in terror.
How then will one answer the messengers of the nation?
That the Lord has founded Zion,
And the afflicted of His people will seek refuge in it.
Isaiah 14:32
The answer is: God in His compassion, is going to protect Zion.
Their hope is in God.
I wanted to at least finish Chapter 14 today :)
Next will be chapter 15.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 19, 2023 10:42:42 GMT -5
Wow, it sounds like you had a busy weekend too! Your daughter is so lucky to have you to help her! I'm hoping we're going to be able to stop being so busy some day soon....
It's amazing reading Isaiah again right now as we watch the world getting darker and believing lies instead of truth. We're seeing the end of the history of the world. It just popped into my mind about the way the Left Behind series showed how the antichrist could kind of control people and make them believe lies instead of the obvious truth they'd actually seen with their own eyes. The book said only those who were really saved had any chance of not believing his lies. In the movie it showed the antichrist killing a bunch of people who were meeting together with him and he made them think one of the dead people had killed the others. Only Kirk Cameron knew what had really happened because he was saved. It sure seems like that's what's actually happening right now. People are believing lies instead of the obvious truth. And the only thing that seems to protect people from the lies is God and His Word.
“The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.” (2 Thessalonians 2:9–12)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 19, 2023 12:02:28 GMT -5
Its interesting you mentioned the Left Behind series.
Devon and I read about 3 different series ( which read one on one day, and another the next etc.)
However we read all 43 or however many of the Kids Left Behind,
and are now going thru the Adult Left Behind, we did read that part!
( I read them years ago, but it's amazing how I missed certain parts, but I did remember that part for sure)
I agree, it is absolutely mindbogglingly to me, that people believe there are more than 2 sexes! When a baby is born isn't it clear that its either a boy or a girl ( what are they 'seeing'????????)
Well... that, a zillion other things!
Yes, the end of the history of the world!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 19, 2023 12:38:13 GMT -5
The oracle concerning Moab.
Surely in a night Ar of Moab is devastated and ruined;
Surely in a night Kir of Moab is devastated and ruined.
Isaiah 15:1
Sudden destruction of these two cities.
Ar was either a chief city, or the capital.
These people were neighbors of the Jews,
and were descended from Lot,
therefore related by blood.
But as it is today, sometimes 'families',
are the worst enemies and the least compassionate.
But once again, this is not a random, blind chance happening,
God is foretelling it, and is therefore in control.
Like people today, people back then,
had the innate tendency to be blind to God.
In any case, they were not expecting this to happen.
They have gone up to the temple and to Dibon,
even to the high places to weep.
Moab wails over Nebo and Medeba;
Everyone's head is bald and every beard is cut off.
Isaiah 15:2
So they go to an idolatrous temple and weep before their idols.
( but of course, those stone, or wooden idols will not save them).
Cutting off their hair was a sign or symbol of their great mourning.
In their streets they have girded themselves with sackcloth;
On their housetops and in their squares
Everyone is wailing, dissolved in tears
Isaiah 15:3
Sackcloth is another symbol of mourning and deep sorrow.
All people could be very sad ( and cry) at such destruction and devastation,
but I think, it is even more so for unbelievers because they don't have 'any' hope.
Their idols are totally useless.
Let us keep our eyes on Jesus,
as we watch our very own destruction
( slower, in one way... but extremely fast in another)
We are not without hope,
we can look up as our salvation draws nearer and nearer.
It is sometimes easy to forget that
so we can encourage and remind one another!!
Done for Today.
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Post by Cindy on Jun 20, 2023 10:13:33 GMT -5
That's great that you're reading the adult ones with him now! The Lord our God has used you in wonderful ways to show your grandson the Truth so he will not be blinded by lies. Instead he will know the truth and be set free! Sadly, all those who aren't saved have a reprobate mind, they're literally insane. That's why they can see more than two sexes. But I know you know that. 
When we read about Moab mourning, it makes me so sad. It even reminds me in a way of how I was before I was saved. I can remember times I wasn't sad because of what I'd done, but only because I'd gotten caught at it. They're mourning exactly how people during the Tribulation will "mourn".
“They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.” (Revelation 16:9)
“and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.” (Revelation 16:11)
“From the sky huge hailstones of about a hundred pounds each fell upon men. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible.” (Revelation 16:21)
What I find interesting too is the Moabites were the product of Lot’s incestuous union with his daughter (Gen. 19:30–38) and they were the enemies of the Jews even though they were related (as you said). Plus, Jesus had, in Ruth the wife of Boaz, a Moabite ancestor (Ru 4:13–22). So there was at least one Moabite that repented of their sins. Sad that those who are saved are always a very small minority.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 20, 2023 12:51:34 GMT -5
Heshbon and Elealeh also cry out,
Their voice is heard all the way to Jahaz;
Therefore the armed men of Moab cry aloud;
His soul trembles within him.
Isaiah 15:4
Our hearts go out, to some extent, to stubborn,
proud and obstinate people, who are slaves to sin,
and now are in terror.
But even to this day, it is sometimes, the way,
people finally come to God...
only when they reach the bottom,
and have come to the end of themselves,
and are in total fear and despair.
However, on the other hand,
sometimes, people are beyond any chance,
all hope is gone,
and judgment from God, torments them to their very soul...
and their lives are now nothing but grievous.
My heart cries out for Moab;
His fugitives are as far as Zoar and Eglath-shelishiyah,
For they go up the ascent of Luhith weeping;
Surely on the road to Horonaim
they raise a cry of distress over their ruin.
Isaiah 15:5
But here in this verse we see that Isaiah cries for them,with deep pity and compassion. He has sympathy and anguish for their suffering.
It is almost unimaginable to think of the unending suffering of impenitent sinners.
These stubborn Moabites, ( who escaped)
who had lived in the lap of luxury,
are now banished as far as Zoar.
Pride and exalting oneself,
does not pay in the end!
Done for today
( not one wink of sleep last night...back to that arrgghh!:(
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 20, 2023 13:14:10 GMT -5
As always, you added information is so great! Thank you :)
Today was super short...no sleep last night
I have actually been sleeping fairly well recently!
So in a way, I can't complain, because I have been blessed
but it does mean, I can't concentrate, start to nod off,
and am afraid I will make some big mistake.
I know I make some, but
Hossanah and all of them, came back yesterday
so I chatted quite a bit with them
( and I guess that was on my mind...
and did not help with sleeping.
Devon told me, for instance
that one of the guests
brought their distant relatives...
And the parents, had a 12 year old and a nine year old boys.
Devon said the 12 year old, sat in a corner one night,
chugging a beer ( his parents said nothing to him about it)
and
the nine year old was taking some 'taste' sips.
On the other hand, Devon talked about a lot of uplifting
personal thoughts
like:
he does not think the same way that basically everybody at High school
concerning dating....
he thinks dating fosters a lack of real commitment etc etc etc.
He hates the sexual jokes his friends insist on telling..
he has called them on it a lot,
and they, in turn ask what is wrong with him???
Sometimes ( well about 90% of the time)
Devon is...acting, thinking etc.
most of the time,
like a 40 or 50 year old
except...
when he acts, thinks and behaves like....
a 2 year old!!
for example when he was showing us how the kids 'dance' at school...
very awkward moves,
not pretty moves at all...
but then,
I took ballet lessons.... sooooo
but no...
the way the teens dance now is just plain....ugly!!!
and he thinks it's funny when his mom and I go eeewwwww
LOL
so he keeps it up
( like ahem!!! a 2 year old might)!!!
sigh!!!
This too shall pass haha
right?
It will pass yes
Oh wait, it did for my 2
so I guess
meanwhile I need blinders
in case he tries so called 'dancing' again!
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Post by Cindy on Jun 21, 2023 11:00:34 GMT -5
I don't think Devon talks like a 40-50 year old. I think he talks like someone who has the Holy Spirit dwelling within him. And I think that's in large part due to all your work with him. He's very blessed to have you in his life. 
Sorry, I have to run now!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 22, 2023 12:47:54 GMT -5
You are right!!! He has the Holy Spirit! Thank you so much for pointing that out! I am going to tell him that :)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 22, 2023 13:33:40 GMT -5
For the waters of Nimrim are desolate.
Surely the grass is withered,
the tender grass died out,
There is no green thing.
Isaiah 15:6
If the water is dried up,
then that is a desperate situation,
and vegetation will certainly not grow.
Therefore the abundance
which they have acquired and stored up
They carry off over the brook of Arabim.
Isaiah 15:7
Because of the severe water shortage or drought
they will have to move, to what sounds like a lesser place.
For the cry of distress
has gone around the territory of Moab,
Its wail goes as far as Eglaim
and its wailing even to Beer-elim.
Isaiah 15:8
Distress, crying, wailing is throughout the territory.
And there is also this:
For the waters of Dimon are full of blood;
Surely I will bring added woes upon Dimon,
A lion upon the fugitives of Moab
and upon the remnant of the land.
Isaiah 15:9
So many have been killed,
the water is full of blood.
Nevertheless, there will be additional calamities...
if they have avoided death one way,
then, they are met with new dangers
( and most likely death).
Send the tribute lamb
to the ruler of the land,
From Sela by way of the wilderness
to the mountain of the daughter of Zion.
Isaiah 16:1
This seems a bit confusing,
who is talking to whom?
I can't help but think,
at least in a spiritual sense,
the only real hope for Moab is Jesus
( the lamb of God).
Perhaps,sending a lamb was a way of admitting defeat,
and acknowledging subjugation, in those days?
He defeated Moab,
and measured them with the line,
making them lie down on the ground;
and he measured two lines to put to death
and one full line to keep alive.
And the Moabites became servants to David,
bringing tribute.
2 Samuel 8:2
And like this:
Now Mesha king of Moab was a sheep breeder,
and used to pay the king of Israel
100,000 lambs and the wool of 100,000 rams.
2 Kings 3:4
In any case,
they could have avoided this by acknowledging God,
and repenting earlier.
The question is:
Is there still any hope for them?
There does come a time when God is done calling people,
and having pity and mercy on them.
I have heard people say in our day and age:
When I am old, I will 'think' about God.
That is a very risky position to take...
a person can die before they get old,
and they may have become so hardened in their hearts and minds,
that they have even less interest in God.
Plus, God may have given them up to their sins and given up on them,
so they no longer can be saved.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 23, 2023 11:26:19 GMT -5
You are right!!! He has the Holy Spirit! Thank you so much for pointing that out! I am going to tell him that :)
“Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To God’s elect, strangers in the world, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia,” (1 Peter 1:1)
“Dear friends, I urge you, as aliens and strangers in the world, to abstain from sinful desires, which war against your soul.” (1 Peter 2:11)
For the waters of Nimrim are desolate.
Surely the grass is withered,
the tender grass died out,
There is no green thing.
Isaiah 15:6
If the water is dried up,
then that is a desperate situation,
and vegetation will certainly not grow.
Therefore the abundance
which they have acquired and stored up
They carry off over the brook of Arabim.
Isaiah 15:7
Because of the severe water shortage or drought
they will have to move, to what sounds like a lesser place.
For the cry of distress
has gone around the territory of Moab,
Its wail goes as far as Eglaim
and its wailing even to Beer-elim.
Isaiah 15:8
Distress, crying, wailing is throughout the territory.
And there is also this:
For the waters of Dimon are full of blood;
Surely I will bring added woes upon Dimon,
A lion upon the fugitives of Moab
and upon the remnant of the land.
Isaiah 15:9
So many have been killed,
the water is full of blood.
Nevertheless, there will be additional calamities...
if they have avoided death one way,
then, they are met with new dangers
( and most likely death).
Send the tribute lamb
to the ruler of the land,
From Sela by way of the wilderness
to the mountain of the daughter of Zion.
Isaiah 16:1
This seems a bit confusing,
who is talking to whom?
I can't help but think,
at least in a spiritual sense,
the only real hope for Moab is Jesus
( the lamb of God).
Perhaps,sending a lamb was a way of admitting defeat,
and acknowledging subjugation, in those days?
He defeated Moab,
and measured them with the line,
making them lie down on the ground;
and he measured two lines to put to death
and one full line to keep alive.
And the Moabites became servants to David,
bringing tribute.
2 Samuel 8:2
And like this:
Now Mesha king of Moab was a sheep breeder,
and used to pay the king of Israel
100,000 lambs and the wool of 100,000 rams.
2 Kings 3:4
In any case,
they could have avoided this by acknowledging God,
and repenting earlier.
The question is:
Is there still any hope for them?
There does come a time when God is done calling people,
and having pity and mercy on them.
I have heard people say in our day and age:
When I am old, I will 'think' about God.
That is a very risky position to take...
a person can die before they get old,
and they may have become so hardened in their hearts and minds,
that they have even less interest in God.
Plus, God may have given them up to their sins and given up on them,
so they no longer can be saved.
Done for today
“The waters of Nimrim are dried up and the grass is withered; the vegetation is gone and nothing green is left. So the wealth they have acquired and stored up they carry away over the Ravine of the Poplars.” (Isaiah 15:6–7)
“Their outcry echoes along the border of Moab; their wailing reaches as far as Eglaim, their lamentation as far as Beer Elim. Dimon’s waters are full of blood, but I will bring still more upon Dimon— a lion upon the fugitives of Moab and upon those who remain in the land.” (Isaiah 15:8–9)
The Assyrians would destroy any crops or anything at all that would help Moab in any way. They were a very violent, and just plain nasty nation. They enjoyed torturing and killing people. They always took anything of value they discovered in any city they attacked and carried it off to their land. The attacking army always fouled up the water that they passed. Since this is a desert region, I would think that's probably the worst thing anyone could do to another. The blood could be from the Moabites that were killed in the war, or even the Assyrians. The Assyrians didn't respect anyone, including themselves, so it wouldn't bother them to throw their own dead into water as well as their enemy. As one commentary says: "The Assyrians took pride in cruel and bloody tactics that kept their subjects living in fear." When the Moabite survivors were fleeing, they would have to deal with the wild animals. Actually, as bad as a lion attacking them would be, I'd think that would be better than anything the Assyrians would do to them! I wouldn't be surprised if that's how they felt too.
Chapter 16 continues this picture. They're sending lambs to Jerusalem is a way of saying they will submit to Jerusalem's king and to Jerusalem's God if Jerusalem will take them in and protect them. Sela is another name for Petra, the capital of Edom. This was a natural hiding place for the Moabites as well as the Edomites with whom they were in confederation. Isaiah urges them to send a peace offering from this hiding place to Zion. I'll stop here as I don't want to get ahead of you. LOL that's one way to get me to stop!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 23, 2023 13:22:48 GMT -5
 
Thank you...
you could tell, I was a 'wee' bit shaky
concerning that part huh?
And just before I came to post for today,
and look and see if you posted:
I thought:
I have a feeling Cindy,
may have posted some information
to help me out with yesterday's post 
And...yup!
There you are :)
Thank you!
Thank you for taking the time also.
I know you have been busier than a one handed wall paper hanger!
Something my adopted parents used to say.
They were born in the 1890's
and so to hang wall paper back in the day...
was a 'real' project, not simplified like today.
You had to put the glue or whatever on the back yourself
and then 'hang' it ( without it wrinkling etc. etc. etc.)
I never saw them do it
But my dad was a contractor and builder, carpenter etc.
so he did a lot of that..,
He not only built homes, shingled roofs, did all the electric
( he had gone to MIT to be an electrician first,
and then went into building homes)
But I know wallpapering,
was part of the whole process,
as well as painting the inside and outside of homes.
So yeah...I know you have been soooooooooo soooooo sooooo busy!!!!
and I do so appreciate your taking time to read my Bible study
and adding info...
especially....... when I am a bit on shaky ground :)
Thank you
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 23, 2023 13:51:54 GMT -5
Then, like fleeing birds or scattered nestlings,
The daughters of Moab will be at the fords of the Arnon.
Isaiah 16:2
I can't help but think of what you wrote,
it would be better for them to be eaten by a lion,
than what the Assyrians would do to them!!
So when a bird's nest is destroyed,
they have no place of safety or rest to go to,
and they would be exposed to all manner of dangers,
with no respite.
I am sure the daughters were in constant terror.
Crossing the river would just be another frightful difficulty.
"Give us advice, make a decision;
Cast your shadow like night at high noon;
Hide the outcasts, do not betray the fugitive.
Isaiah 16:3
This reminds me that sometimes people continue to disregard God,
as did the Moabites of old,
believing in their pride,
is to be intellectually superior,
freely indulging in licentiousness,
enjoying prosperity
filled with fraud and injustice
etc.
( why does this remind me of USA?)
until... they lose everything...
and now are subjects of the cruelty,
which they had wielded towards others.
Then...they petition and cry out to God.
They want God to do what is right...
or rather have pity on them.
Shade is a relief from the hot hot scorching intense heat of the sun...
which could be symbolic, for the scorching judgment on them.
They want to be concealed ( from their enemies),
and protected.
Done for today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 24, 2023 13:02:41 GMT -5
"Let the outcasts of Moab stay with you;
Be a hiding place to them from the destroyer."
For the extortioner has come to an end,
destruction has ceased,
Oppressors have completely disappeared from the land.
Isaiah 16:4
I think the outcasts would mostly be Moabites,
but perhaps also, might refer to some or a few exiled Jews,
who took refuge in the land of Moab.
The Moabites for the most part,
did not act like this to the Jews....
with kindness and compassion.
We learn from this verse,
to be kind and compassionate to fugitives and exiles,
especially to believers.
The enemies have been removed.
A throne will even be established in lovingkindness,
And a judge will sit on it
in faithfulness in the tent of David;
Moreover, he will seek justice
And be prompt in righteousness.
Isaiah 16:5
This seems to me to be a future promise in the far distant future
for when Jesus is King of Kings,
but a shorter prophecy would most likely refer to,
Hezekiah who was a type of Christ.
We have heard of the pride of Moab,
an excessive pride;
Even of his arrogance, pride, and fury;
His idle boasts are false.
Isaiah 16:6
I just notice how often pride
is THE number one offender,
from out of which,
comes many other sins and evils.
“We have heard of the pride of Moab—
he is very proud—
Of his haughtiness,
his pride,
his arrogance
and his self-exaltation.
Jeremiah 48:29
However, Pride cannot prevent God from overthrowing them!
Nor any amount of arsenals!
Therefore, idol boasts are false.
Done for today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 26, 2023 12:42:10 GMT -5
Therefore Moab will wail;
everyone of Moab will wail.
You will moan for the raisin cakes of Kir-hareseth
As those who are utterly stricken.
Isaiah 16:7
There will be a universal lamentation throughout Moab,
and there will be great despair and wailing in Moab.
It seems that Raisin cakes were a major export of Moab,
and that the Moabites relished them as a delicious delicacy.
Being used to living the high life,
being proud and arrogant,
and then coming to utter ruin,
they are utterly stricken.
Their idols do not offer help or comfort,
and they do not have the true God.
For the fields of Heshbon have withered,
the vines of Sibmah as well;
The lords of the nations have trampled down its choice clusters
Which reached as far as Jazer and wandered to the deserts;
Its tendrils spread themselves out and passed over the sea.
Isaiah 16:8
The fields were their vineyards,
which had been highly esteemed,
were destroyed.
The vines had extended far,
( even to Jazer)
and were very luxuriant....
Now they were ruined.
Therefore I will weep bitterly for Jazer,
for the vine of Sibmah;
I will drench you with my tears,
O Heshbon and Elealeh;
For the shouting over your summer fruits
and your harvest has fallen away.
Isaiah 16:9
So great will the devastation be,
that Isaiah
( and/or perhaps God Himself),
will cry for them.
He had a heart of compassion,
and felt a deep sorrow for their terrible severe affliction,
overwhelming loss, adversity etc.
It is extremely sad, the wicked will not turn,
but refuse to turn to God,
The judgment is always just,
but it did not have to be,
but they would NOT!
Now not only is the country in ruins ( buildings etc.)
but their way of making money is gone...
is famine and more death, not far behind?
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 27, 2023 11:00:44 GMT -5
I'm glad I was able to help. But you're doing great! I've enjoyed reading what you've posted. Have to take Chris back to the doctor today, and my daughter too! 
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 27, 2023 16:06:46 GMT -5
Oh wow! The saying, a mother's work never ends, does sort of apply to you!!!!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 27, 2023 16:36:55 GMT -5
Gladness and joy are taken away from the fruitful field;
In the vineyards also there will be no cries of joy or jubilant shouting, No treader treads out wine in the presses,
For I have made the shouting to cease
Isaiah 16:10
The normal celebration at harvest time, has been canceled...
no singing or dancing,
nor joy or gladness.
We see this also in Jeremiah.
So gladness and joy are taken away
From the fruitful field, even from the land of Moab.
And I have made the wine to cease from the wine presses;
No one will tread them with shouting,
The shouting will not be shouts of joy.
Jeremiah 48:33
There is deeply felt sorrow, from both the prophet Isaiah and the Lord,
concerning the necessary and essential judgment of Moab,
as expressed in this next verse:
Therefore my heart intones like a harp for Moab
And my inward feelings for Kir-hareseth.
Isaiah 16:11
Neither God nor Isaiah,
are lacking in deep feelings of compassion,
and pity.
So it will come about when Moab presents himself,
When he wearies himself upon his high place,
And comes to his sanctuary to pray,
That he will not prevail.
Isaiah 16:12
The idol religion of Moab
(the temple of Chemosh and other idols)
has totally failed.
Their idols did not deliver them, they exhausted and wearied them.
Still they went to their 'sacred' temple,
hoping against hope,
but to no avail.
done for today
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Post by Cindy on Jun 28, 2023 10:41:46 GMT -5
Because Moab refused to admit that she needed to repent of her pride and acknowledge that she needed God, God took away her harvest, so there wouldn't be any harvest festival that year. It reminds me of myself actually. I don't know how many different things that I've refused to admit I needed God for. For example, it was many years after I was saved that I realized that God was who I needed for my health, not just a doctor. Before that, my first and only thought when I'd get sick was, "I need to call the doctor". It simply never occurred to me to call on the Lord first and then call the doctor. I'm not at all saying we shouldn't call our doctor, we should! But we should also speak the Lord and tell Him what our problem is and ask Him to guide our doctor, and so on. That's what King Hezekiah learned the hard way. It wasn't until the prophet came and told him he was going to die that it occurred to him to pray. I have to admit, that when I'm sick even now there are times I'll forget to pray about it.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,397
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Post by fearnot on Jun 28, 2023 11:11:27 GMT -5
Good point! We are so used to relying on self, or others....
God is a distant third often.
Many have their priority upside down.
Thank you for the reminder
( as always :)
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Very well said! 
I really enjoy reading what you write too, as you often give me something new to chew on for awhile. I have lots of notes in my Bible that start with, "Barbara said...." 
I hope you're able to get some sleep soon hon. 
