Post by Cindy on Jul 30, 2016 9:54:15 GMT -5
Throw Out the Baby, Spit Out the Bones & Throw the Water on Sound Doctrine
2 Timothy 4:2-5 Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.
Our children have often laughed when I've unwittingly managed to mix metaphors. It's one of those trivial details that have not been important enough for me to value or learn. Consequently, I've often fumbled for the right beginning and ending to an often meaningless saying, much to the delight of my family. It has been amazing to me over the last several years how many Christians, including Pastors, have these sayings down pat. So much so, that "we don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater" and " I eat the meat and spit out the bones" have become sound doctrine. Not just secular sayings, but sound doctrine that overrides Scriptural truth. In fact I've been rebuked by those sayings, when relaying the facts on a particular issue. I've asked people who quote these sayings for the Scriptural reference to them, so that I too could claim them as Biblical truth, but none have been forthcoming. Occasionally a misuse of a particular Scripture is cited to validate one saying, but it really doesn't mean what people want it to mean.
God said that His Word is perfect and from it we would get sound doctrine. 2 Timothy 3:14-17 But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. It stands to reason then, that we should be able to put what we believe and teach to the test of Scriptural truth. Our example is found in Acts 17:11 "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. " Lets look at the saying, which I've heard used to defend anything from Promise Keepers to psychology and the ecumenical movement.
"We don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater." Historically the saying came from a German poem from the fifteenth century and became a common saying for not throwing out the good with the bad. It came from the old practice of using one tub of water to wash in, starting with the father, with the baby being the last to be bathed in what became filthy, murky water. The fear was that the baby would get lost in the filth and be thrown out with the mucky water. Some suggest once a year was custom for the bath, monthly might have been a luxury. Regardless, man's fleshly wisdom isn't usually aligned with God's wisdom. Perhaps the correct and Biblical response to not throwing the baby out with the bathwater is, "what is the baby doing in that filthy, disgusting water in the first place?" Simple hygiene dictates that the baby will become diseased and unhealthy if placed in filthy water. The purpose of the baby's bath is to make it come out different than when it went in. Filthy water doesn't clean, it makes things become muddy and unclear .
After finding no actual Scripture reference to this saying, one can then try to suggest a Scripture that means the same thing. Is there a Scripture that means one should keep a bad, un-Biblical or unsound source or teaching since there might be some good in it or some good will come out of it?
Some suggest the end justifies the means. ...........On the same vein of false teaching is the saying, "I eat the meat and spit out the bones." It's used countless times to defend using the teachings of favorite icons, who upon evaluation, are far from the Word of God. But they do have "truth teasers" in amongst those bones, so the undiscerning will read and find that "meat" to validate their teachings. Supporters lay claim to the idea that no one is perfect and if they can glean one thing from an otherwise unsound teaching or writing, they'll keep that meat and spit out the offending bones. They don't believe it to be unsound to be taught both doctrinal truth and error and uphold the person who teaches in this manner. If one is that hard up to find sound doctrine, perhaps opening one's Bible is the answer.
There is a Scripture that some will attempt to use to validate this saying, that is really no different in philosophy than the "baby" saying. 1 Thessalonians 5: 21 "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." Most will ignore the first part when defending their stand, and rather suggest that by spitting out the bones they are holding fast to that which is good. If one is to prove all things--meaning prove them to be of the Word of God or not and of the Lord Jesus Christ---then one need not be part of those that would teach falsehood. Holding fast to that which is good is holding fast to the Word of God and sound doctrine.
What many also ignore when "spitting out the bones" is the next verse to the passage "22 Abstain from all appearance of evil." If someone is of the Lord Jesus Christ they are not going to be presenting truth and error as a regular part of their doctrine. This is not talking about spiritual immaturity or lack of knowledge or even an error in understanding. This is taking, for example, the basics of the faith, and perverting them ever so slightly so that Gnostic doctrine is taught. Those in leadership have no excuse for not teaching sound doctrine. It's a requirement. 1 Corinthians 4:1 "Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God. 2 Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful. "Faithful to God and faithful to sound doctrine which resides in Biblical truth.
In 2 Timothy 1:13 Paul wrote,"Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus." Do we see an example of having to learn sound doctrine by ingesting truth and error? Paul said to hold fast to sound words which he gave. He never wrote a letter where one had to find the meat while spitting out the bones. Paul speaks of learning sound doctrine as milk and strong meat in Hebrews 5:12-14. Hebrews 5:12-14 In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God’s word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil. In that passage the milk is for new believers and contains the very basic principles of the faith that all must learn. Strong meat is for the more mature and leads one into the proper use of the Word of God, evident by their being able to discern good and evil and live a life in keeping with Biblical obedience. Not surprisingly Paul does not speak of having to spit out the bones while ingesting the strong meat. If we're actually getting strong meat and sound doctrine, we won't need to discard most of the teaching used to obtain it.
more
www.seekgod.ca/soundoctrine.htm
Satan can perform many wonders including healing. God can and does use even totally evil people so He can certainly use false teachers as well. That doesn't however negate what He told us to do about it. Just like when that false prophetess was preaching the TRUTH and telling people that “These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved.”, Paul didn't say, "listen to her, even she is telling you the truth! Instead he stopped them and demanded the spirit leave the person! He didn't tell people to take the meat and spit out the bones or any such thing. If there is error being taught by a person, a pastor, a teacher or a church or ministry, we are commanded by God to expose it, rebuke them and have nothing at all to do with them unless they repent of the errors. Neither God the Father, God the Son, nor the Holy Spirit EVER contradict His written Word. There simply is no biblical justification for accepting false teachers or anything they teach--not even the "true" parts. That is a lie from Satan which has been accepted and promoted by the world in an attempt to undermine the Lord and His body.
Acts 16:16-18 Once when we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl who had a spirit by which she predicted the future. She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune-telling. This girl followed Paul and the rest of us, shouting, “These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved.” She kept this up for many days. Finally Paul became so troubled that he turned around and said to the spirit, “In the name of Jesus Christ I command you to come out of her!” At that moment the spirit left her.
The "church" doesn't need to be "perfect". The pastor doesn't either except that he needs to teach the whole truth and nothing but the truth and he needs to uphold it in his own life and teach it to those under him. There is nothing at all wrong with a pastor "making a mistake". We're all human and we all make mistakes at times. It becomes wrong however when the pastor is shown his mistake and doesn't examine himself, doesn't search the scriptures and doesn't repent. At that point, the pastor becomes a false teacher until or unless he repents and we should warn others and have nothing more to do with that pastor until or unless he repents. That is what the Bible says. Of course the world wouldn't agree with that as it's not very tolerant at all and certainly isn't "nice" or agreeable. However the bible is quite clear about it whether or not we like it.This was a serious issue even in the apostles time and a large portion of the epistles is about either how to discern a false teacher, what we are to do when we find one, and how and what we ourselves are to teach and preach. God quite obviously wants us to know about this and deal with it His way.
Titus 2:1 You must teach what is in accord with sound doctrine.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
Titus 1:9 He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it.
Titus 1:13 This testimony is true. Therefore, rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith
Titus 1:16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
1 Timothy 4:6-7 If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed. Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives’ tales; rather, train yourself to be godly.
1 Timothy 4:9-13 This is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance (and for this we labor and strive), that we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, and especially of those who believe. Command and teach these things. Don’t let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in speech, in life, in love, in faith and in purity. Until I come, devote yourself to the public reading of Scripture, to preaching and to teaching.
1 Timothy 4:15-16 Be diligent in these matters; give yourself wholly to them, so that everyone may see your progress. Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.
1 Timothy 6:3-5 If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.I could post hundreds more scriptures, literally, but people should be capable of finding them and knowing them for themselves.
That is just another little saying that's supposed to "get us off the hook" just like the two mentioned in the opening post. I was thinking about this last night and it reminded me of what I'd read about in Exodus that Moses did. As I usually find when I read God's Word, it teaches me a great deal about myself as well. Like Moses, I think we all have a tendency to do this. When God tells us He wants us to do something, (such as to have nothing to do with false teachers if they don't repent etc.) our tendency is to make excuses as to why we can't obey Him. Of course we don't put it that way...we would never dare think of ourselves as deliberately not obeying God, but ultimately that's what it comes down to. Instead of telling Him that we won't obey, we generally use terms like, "I can't, or I'm not good enough", or "it's to hard for me", or "I'm not smart enough", or something to indicate that what He has told us to do is impossible. (such as the line about looking for a "perfect church")For the last couple of years I've noticed something else about me and about other believers in general. It seems as though we have been so thoroughly taught that salvation is a free gift, and that salvation is not from works, that we seem to read our bibles as though obedience to God isn't an issue; like we think He doesn't give us any commands at all and we can simply continue to live our lives the way we always have and can pick and choose what we want to do from the Bible if we actually decide we do want to do anything at all.Now I'm exaggerating to a certain extent there just to get the point across but it's basically true. At least it was for me. When I finally realized what I was doing, I decided to start making a list of every single command to believers in the New Testament. I was shocked at just how many there were! As believers we are to obey God when He tells us to do something or not to do something. We are not to make excuses, we are not to try and get out of it, we are simply supposed to do our best to obey and allow Him to do the rest.
In keeping with the subject matter of this thread, the commands we are to obey are that we are to: try the spirits, be bereans and check our Bibles to see if what we've read, or what is being preached or what we've been told or heard is scriptural
• When we find it isn't scriptural we are to rebuke the person (if possible) and show them why it isn't so they can repent
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to mark that person and avoid them
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to have no fellowship with them
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to withdraw from them and turn away from them.
These are not "suggestions" to us. These are commands that we are to obey:
1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.
Titus 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
1 John 4:1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Romans 16:17-18 I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.
Tit 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
2 John 9-11 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14-15 If anyone does not obey our instruction in this letter, take special note of him. Do not associate with him, in order that he may feel ashamed. Yet do not regard him as an enemy, but warn him as a brother.
2 Timothy 3:5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
2 John 9-11 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
2 Timothy 2:15-16 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly.
Jude 3 Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt I had to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints.
1 Peter 2:2-3 Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation, now that you have tasted that the Lord is good.
What I'm getting at though is that those who are truly born again are told not to grieve the Holy Spirit, and being disobedient to His Word most definitely grieves Him. It's almost like what's been done (unintentionally I'm sure!) is that salvation has been changed from being perceived as a free gift, to being perceived as a cheap way to get to heaven free. That's really our own fault though for not stressing the whole Gospel to people and instead trying to almost "trick" them into getting themselves saved. We tell them, "oh you don't have to do anything at all; just pray this prayer and you're done!" And that's just not true. Jesus said that those who call on His Name will be saved, but He also said that those who follow Him MUST take up their cross daily and deny themselves. He Himself told people to "count the cost" of being saved, instead of trying to get them into the kingdom any way He could.
Matthew 22:14 “For many are called, but few are chosen.”
Because that isn't done anymore (for the most part) that's why we have believers who are still infants in Christ 20 years after their salvation, and believers getting sucked into false doctrine because they don't know God's Word. Why should they? They're already saved after all, so why bother reading something that they figure is boring and hard to understand. That's why people who don't know their bibles well, figure they can read any teacher/pastor's books and "spit out the bones".
2 Timothy 4:2-5 Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.
Our children have often laughed when I've unwittingly managed to mix metaphors. It's one of those trivial details that have not been important enough for me to value or learn. Consequently, I've often fumbled for the right beginning and ending to an often meaningless saying, much to the delight of my family. It has been amazing to me over the last several years how many Christians, including Pastors, have these sayings down pat. So much so, that "we don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater" and " I eat the meat and spit out the bones" have become sound doctrine. Not just secular sayings, but sound doctrine that overrides Scriptural truth. In fact I've been rebuked by those sayings, when relaying the facts on a particular issue. I've asked people who quote these sayings for the Scriptural reference to them, so that I too could claim them as Biblical truth, but none have been forthcoming. Occasionally a misuse of a particular Scripture is cited to validate one saying, but it really doesn't mean what people want it to mean.
God said that His Word is perfect and from it we would get sound doctrine. 2 Timothy 3:14-17 But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. It stands to reason then, that we should be able to put what we believe and teach to the test of Scriptural truth. Our example is found in Acts 17:11 "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. " Lets look at the saying, which I've heard used to defend anything from Promise Keepers to psychology and the ecumenical movement.
"We don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater." Historically the saying came from a German poem from the fifteenth century and became a common saying for not throwing out the good with the bad. It came from the old practice of using one tub of water to wash in, starting with the father, with the baby being the last to be bathed in what became filthy, murky water. The fear was that the baby would get lost in the filth and be thrown out with the mucky water. Some suggest once a year was custom for the bath, monthly might have been a luxury. Regardless, man's fleshly wisdom isn't usually aligned with God's wisdom. Perhaps the correct and Biblical response to not throwing the baby out with the bathwater is, "what is the baby doing in that filthy, disgusting water in the first place?" Simple hygiene dictates that the baby will become diseased and unhealthy if placed in filthy water. The purpose of the baby's bath is to make it come out different than when it went in. Filthy water doesn't clean, it makes things become muddy and unclear .
After finding no actual Scripture reference to this saying, one can then try to suggest a Scripture that means the same thing. Is there a Scripture that means one should keep a bad, un-Biblical or unsound source or teaching since there might be some good in it or some good will come out of it?
Some suggest the end justifies the means. ...........On the same vein of false teaching is the saying, "I eat the meat and spit out the bones." It's used countless times to defend using the teachings of favorite icons, who upon evaluation, are far from the Word of God. But they do have "truth teasers" in amongst those bones, so the undiscerning will read and find that "meat" to validate their teachings. Supporters lay claim to the idea that no one is perfect and if they can glean one thing from an otherwise unsound teaching or writing, they'll keep that meat and spit out the offending bones. They don't believe it to be unsound to be taught both doctrinal truth and error and uphold the person who teaches in this manner. If one is that hard up to find sound doctrine, perhaps opening one's Bible is the answer.
There is a Scripture that some will attempt to use to validate this saying, that is really no different in philosophy than the "baby" saying. 1 Thessalonians 5: 21 "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." Most will ignore the first part when defending their stand, and rather suggest that by spitting out the bones they are holding fast to that which is good. If one is to prove all things--meaning prove them to be of the Word of God or not and of the Lord Jesus Christ---then one need not be part of those that would teach falsehood. Holding fast to that which is good is holding fast to the Word of God and sound doctrine.
What many also ignore when "spitting out the bones" is the next verse to the passage "22 Abstain from all appearance of evil." If someone is of the Lord Jesus Christ they are not going to be presenting truth and error as a regular part of their doctrine. This is not talking about spiritual immaturity or lack of knowledge or even an error in understanding. This is taking, for example, the basics of the faith, and perverting them ever so slightly so that Gnostic doctrine is taught. Those in leadership have no excuse for not teaching sound doctrine. It's a requirement. 1 Corinthians 4:1 "Let a man so account of us, as of the ministers of Christ, and stewards of the mysteries of God. 2 Moreover it is required in stewards, that a man be found faithful. "Faithful to God and faithful to sound doctrine which resides in Biblical truth.
In 2 Timothy 1:13 Paul wrote,"Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me, in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus." Do we see an example of having to learn sound doctrine by ingesting truth and error? Paul said to hold fast to sound words which he gave. He never wrote a letter where one had to find the meat while spitting out the bones. Paul speaks of learning sound doctrine as milk and strong meat in Hebrews 5:12-14. Hebrews 5:12-14 In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God’s word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil. In that passage the milk is for new believers and contains the very basic principles of the faith that all must learn. Strong meat is for the more mature and leads one into the proper use of the Word of God, evident by their being able to discern good and evil and live a life in keeping with Biblical obedience. Not surprisingly Paul does not speak of having to spit out the bones while ingesting the strong meat. If we're actually getting strong meat and sound doctrine, we won't need to discard most of the teaching used to obtain it.
more
www.seekgod.ca/soundoctrine.htm
Satan can perform many wonders including healing. God can and does use even totally evil people so He can certainly use false teachers as well. That doesn't however negate what He told us to do about it. Just like when that false prophetess was preaching the TRUTH and telling people that “These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved.”, Paul didn't say, "listen to her, even she is telling you the truth! Instead he stopped them and demanded the spirit leave the person! He didn't tell people to take the meat and spit out the bones or any such thing. If there is error being taught by a person, a pastor, a teacher or a church or ministry, we are commanded by God to expose it, rebuke them and have nothing at all to do with them unless they repent of the errors. Neither God the Father, God the Son, nor the Holy Spirit EVER contradict His written Word. There simply is no biblical justification for accepting false teachers or anything they teach--not even the "true" parts. That is a lie from Satan which has been accepted and promoted by the world in an attempt to undermine the Lord and His body.
Acts 16:16-18 Once when we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl who had a spirit by which she predicted the future. She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune-telling. This girl followed Paul and the rest of us, shouting, “These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved.” She kept this up for many days. Finally Paul became so troubled that he turned around and said to the spirit, “In the name of Jesus Christ I command you to come out of her!” At that moment the spirit left her.
The "church" doesn't need to be "perfect". The pastor doesn't either except that he needs to teach the whole truth and nothing but the truth and he needs to uphold it in his own life and teach it to those under him. There is nothing at all wrong with a pastor "making a mistake". We're all human and we all make mistakes at times. It becomes wrong however when the pastor is shown his mistake and doesn't examine himself, doesn't search the scriptures and doesn't repent. At that point, the pastor becomes a false teacher until or unless he repents and we should warn others and have nothing more to do with that pastor until or unless he repents. That is what the Bible says. Of course the world wouldn't agree with that as it's not very tolerant at all and certainly isn't "nice" or agreeable. However the bible is quite clear about it whether or not we like it.This was a serious issue even in the apostles time and a large portion of the epistles is about either how to discern a false teacher, what we are to do when we find one, and how and what we ourselves are to teach and preach. God quite obviously wants us to know about this and deal with it His way.
Titus 2:1 You must teach what is in accord with sound doctrine.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
Titus 1:9 He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it.
Titus 1:13 This testimony is true. Therefore, rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith
Titus 1:16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
1 Timothy 4:6-7 If you point these things out to the brothers, you will be a good minister of Christ Jesus, brought up in the truths of the faith and of the good teaching that you have followed. Have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives’ tales; rather, train yourself to be godly.
1 Timothy 4:9-13 This is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance (and for this we labor and strive), that we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, and especially of those who believe. Command and teach these things. Don’t let anyone look down on you because you are young, but set an example for the believers in speech, in life, in love, in faith and in purity. Until I come, devote yourself to the public reading of Scripture, to preaching and to teaching.
1 Timothy 4:15-16 Be diligent in these matters; give yourself wholly to them, so that everyone may see your progress. Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers.
1 Timothy 6:3-5 If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.I could post hundreds more scriptures, literally, but people should be capable of finding them and knowing them for themselves.
That is just another little saying that's supposed to "get us off the hook" just like the two mentioned in the opening post. I was thinking about this last night and it reminded me of what I'd read about in Exodus that Moses did. As I usually find when I read God's Word, it teaches me a great deal about myself as well. Like Moses, I think we all have a tendency to do this. When God tells us He wants us to do something, (such as to have nothing to do with false teachers if they don't repent etc.) our tendency is to make excuses as to why we can't obey Him. Of course we don't put it that way...we would never dare think of ourselves as deliberately not obeying God, but ultimately that's what it comes down to. Instead of telling Him that we won't obey, we generally use terms like, "I can't, or I'm not good enough", or "it's to hard for me", or "I'm not smart enough", or something to indicate that what He has told us to do is impossible. (such as the line about looking for a "perfect church")For the last couple of years I've noticed something else about me and about other believers in general. It seems as though we have been so thoroughly taught that salvation is a free gift, and that salvation is not from works, that we seem to read our bibles as though obedience to God isn't an issue; like we think He doesn't give us any commands at all and we can simply continue to live our lives the way we always have and can pick and choose what we want to do from the Bible if we actually decide we do want to do anything at all.Now I'm exaggerating to a certain extent there just to get the point across but it's basically true. At least it was for me. When I finally realized what I was doing, I decided to start making a list of every single command to believers in the New Testament. I was shocked at just how many there were! As believers we are to obey God when He tells us to do something or not to do something. We are not to make excuses, we are not to try and get out of it, we are simply supposed to do our best to obey and allow Him to do the rest.
In keeping with the subject matter of this thread, the commands we are to obey are that we are to: try the spirits, be bereans and check our Bibles to see if what we've read, or what is being preached or what we've been told or heard is scriptural
• When we find it isn't scriptural we are to rebuke the person (if possible) and show them why it isn't so they can repent
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to mark that person and avoid them
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to have no fellowship with them
• If they don't or haven't repented we are to withdraw from them and turn away from them.
These are not "suggestions" to us. These are commands that we are to obey:
1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
2 Timothy 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.
Titus 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
1 John 4:1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Romans 16:17-18 I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.
Tit 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
2 John 9-11 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
2 Thessalonians 3:14-15 If anyone does not obey our instruction in this letter, take special note of him. Do not associate with him, in order that he may feel ashamed. Yet do not regard him as an enemy, but warn him as a brother.
2 Timothy 3:5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
2 John 9-11 Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
2 Timothy 2:15-16 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly.
Jude 3 Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt I had to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints.
1 Peter 2:2-3 Like newborn babies, crave pure spiritual milk, so that by it you may grow up in your salvation, now that you have tasted that the Lord is good.
What I'm getting at though is that those who are truly born again are told not to grieve the Holy Spirit, and being disobedient to His Word most definitely grieves Him. It's almost like what's been done (unintentionally I'm sure!) is that salvation has been changed from being perceived as a free gift, to being perceived as a cheap way to get to heaven free. That's really our own fault though for not stressing the whole Gospel to people and instead trying to almost "trick" them into getting themselves saved. We tell them, "oh you don't have to do anything at all; just pray this prayer and you're done!" And that's just not true. Jesus said that those who call on His Name will be saved, but He also said that those who follow Him MUST take up their cross daily and deny themselves. He Himself told people to "count the cost" of being saved, instead of trying to get them into the kingdom any way He could.
Matthew 22:14 “For many are called, but few are chosen.”
Because that isn't done anymore (for the most part) that's why we have believers who are still infants in Christ 20 years after their salvation, and believers getting sucked into false doctrine because they don't know God's Word. Why should they? They're already saved after all, so why bother reading something that they figure is boring and hard to understand. That's why people who don't know their bibles well, figure they can read any teacher/pastor's books and "spit out the bones".
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