fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383 
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Post by fearnot on Nov 26, 2021 13:14:17 GMT -5
My words in this color
Scripture in this color
What thoughts do we need to take captive?
Why should we?
and How do we do that?
I may come back, later to this list in Philippians,
Isaiah etc
but just so we know,
there are some things we can think on,
(so we don't get discouraged by the seemingly endless list of sinful things,
we do often muse on),
Here are two uplifting verses on godly thoughts:
]8 Finally, brothers,
whatever is true,
whatever is honorable,
whatever is just,
whatever is pure,
whatever is lovely,
whatever is commendable,
if there is any excellence,
if there is anything worthy of praise,
think about these things.
Philippians 4:8
Also
You keep him in perfect peace
whose mind is stayed on you,
because he trusts in you.
Isaiah 26:3
I will start with what thoughts do we need to take captive.
5 We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion
raised against the knowledge of God,
and take every thought captive to obey Christ,
2 Corinthians 10:5
We all have a war going on in our mind,
with thoughts that do not line up with God's thoughts or the Bible.
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh,
but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit.
6 For to set the mind on the flesh is death,
but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace.
Romans 8:5-6
And although this verse says the 'heart',
I think it works well with our minds also:
The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately sick;
who can understand it?
Jeremiah 17:9
And this battle ground, in our minds, is not just our own,
but even Satan and his demons can entices our minds,
to be directed toward all manner of ideas, desires, thoughts etc.,
other than the Lord
12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood,
but against the rulers, against the authorities,
against the cosmic powers over this present darkness,
against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places
Ephesians 6:12
And though this verse singles out unbelievers,
if we do not take our thoughts captive,
we too can become prey for a time:
In their case the god of this world
has blinded the minds of the unbelievers,
to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ,
who is the image of God.
2 Corinthians 4:4
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Post by Cindy on Nov 27, 2021 11:24:45 GMT -5
Good one, but I'm not sure why you started another one when we're doing one for and with Eva now? I can't do two or more at a time, so can we wait until the one we're doing with Eva is finished to do this one?
But just to set the record straight, as I've said many other times, when the Bible uses the word "heart" or when it uses the word "mind", both mean the same thing in the original language. They didn't use a separate word for each one. Heart meant thoughts and feelings and so does the word translated "mind". Translators used our words for heart and mind to try and make it seem more like how we'd say things. I'm not the only one to say this. MacArthur and most of the other commentaries say this as well. No one says this isn't true, but some simply don't bring it up at all.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Nov 27, 2021 13:00:31 GMT -5
Oh cool....I was confused if I should also do both or just the one we are doing with Eva....I will work on that with you and her, and leave this until way after.
Thanks! :)
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Post by Cindy on Feb 11, 2022 10:30:37 GMT -5
You could do this one when you're waiting for Eva to reply if you want to.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 2, 2022 11:47:05 GMT -5
God tells us we are to take thoughts captive.
We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion
raised against the knowledge of God,
and take every thought captive to obey Christ
2 Corinthians 10:5
I would venture to say, that human so called:
wisdom,
reason,
plans,
cleverness,
theories,
ideologies,
entertainment,
philosophical musings,
psychological speculations,
lofty opinions,
so called 'science'
evolution,
false religions,
atheism
pride,
lust
etc. etc. etc.
all fit into thoughts that need to be taken captive.
Really, any thought that is not pleasing to God needs to be destroyed.
I want to look at them in a bit more depth.
As scripture tells us:
For as he thinks in his heart, so is he...
Proverbs 23:7
and
Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth,
and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Genesis 6:5
Also
For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts,
murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies
Matthew 15:19
These are not frivolous, innocuous, harmless, thoughts,
they are evil, and need to be fought against, and destroyed
as the most fearsome enemies on earth,
because,
they are.
We have to fight a battle,
more than that,
we fight a war...
and sadly, (tho it gets better....
and we win more and more, over time...),
it is a battle that lasts a life time.
We can never relax and think we have won
( tho in the end, we will be victorious,
because of our Lord and Savior, Jesus).
As in any war, we are going to capture
prisoners, but these prisoners are in the mind.
The world has built fortresses against God
and then intend to use them,
we are often fighting an ideological warfare.
This is not to say, we don't also need to fight against
our very own, sinful thoughts in our mind.
Our very own, Trojan horses,
that have infiltrated and lived in our minds for years, and sometimes decades.
Instead:
do not be conformed to this world,
but be transformed by the renewing of your mind,
so that you may prove what the will of God is,
that which is good and acceptable and perfect
Romans 12:2
We do that by taking thoughts captive and replacing them with God's truth.
But more of that tomorrow.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 3, 2022 10:15:06 GMT -5
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 3, 2022 12:55:07 GMT -5
Strangely enough, the first thoughts I think need to be taken captive
are prideful thoughts.
Why I say it is strange,
is because in today's world,
there has been a big big push
to teach children to be:
"proud of your self'
'be true to your self'
'be who you are'
'you can be whatever you want to be'
etc.
and if I had a dollar for how many times I have heard mom's say:
GOOD JOB!
I would now be rich!
Today there are all sorts of pride parades
and proud groups...
Interesting when we remember, Pride was the devil's downfall.
As Christians, we know all men and woman are sinners by nature
and pride is right up there as a core sin.
( is that how we want to be true to ourselves?)
For we know that the law is spiritual,
but I am of the flesh,
sold under sin
Romans 7:14
and
10 as it is written:
“None is righteous,
no,
not one
Romans 3:10
And in addition:
When we are immersed in pride,
we think our thoughts,
are far superior to God,
whose thoughts we consider as 'foolish'.
14 But a natural man
does not accept the things of the Spirit of God,
for they are foolishness to him;
and he cannot understand them,
because they are spiritually appraised
1 Corinthians 2:14
Clearly thoughts that are so full of pride
to the point of thinking, that our thoughts,
are superior to God's thoughts
( that we deem foolish)....
need to be taken captive,
not encouraged!
Telling children that they are so wonderful,
they can be and do whatever they want in life
is a lie.
A child could in fact be a true bona fide genius....
but even that child cannot be whatever he or she chooses.
Perhaps they want to be a singer, but are totally tone deaf...
maybe they want to be a dancer, but have no gracefulness at all,
maybe they want to be a soldier, but have no stomach for war
etc. etc. etc.
The damage is in the lie, that by just being proud,
and being true to yourself,
you are the captain of yourself ,
and can do or be whatever you want....
when in fact, pride
is NOT a guarantee you can be or do whatever you want.
But there are far more dangers than that,
concerning the sin of pride,
if a person does not take those thoughts captive.
In fact, such thinking borders on insanity!
And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer,
God gave them over to a depraved mind,
to do those things which are not proper
Romans 1:28
Pride was Satan's downfall!
12 “How you have fallen from heaven,
O star of the morning, son of the dawn!
You have been cut down to the earth,
You who have weakened the nations!
13 “But you said in your heart,
‘I will ascend to heaven;
I will raise my throne above the stars of God,
And I will sit on the mount of assembly
In the recesses of the north.
14 ‘I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.’
Isaiah 14:12-14
I have read before that even in the word pride,
the middle letter is "I"
All about 'self'
Self fulfillment rarely is loving,
( if ever...most likely, never)
because such a person will climb over anyone,
to reach their goals.
Thinking you are the greatest,
and can reach the top of whatever you choose,
might be a type of self love,
but is lacking true love, compassion, mercy etc.
Pride ( and prideful thoughts)
really is a basic core corruption,
and major sin of humans.
It is pride that causes rebellion against God
( Just as it worked in Satan).
Instead of being 'true' to our sinful proud selves
we ought to want to die to that kind of selfish self....
and annihilate ( take captive)
any thoughts that encourage such pride.
I may finish this tomorrow.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 4, 2022 9:11:32 GMT -5
I totally agree with you! All I would add is that pride has many faces, such as when we constantly insist we're no good in some way, etc. But I'm sure you'll be covering that as well! 
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 4, 2022 13:41:20 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy
and yes....all sorts of pride...
thank you as always
I will include your suggestion of course.... :) thank you!!!
I will try to work on this today, but there is a whole lot going on,
(like: Brian's mom had a stroke, Ali went to 'stay' ( as in run away fro home kind of)
at 'boyfriend's home,
Brian had to get a policeman to bring her back home,
( so poor guy, his mom is in hospital due to stroke, and daughter is acting up big time etc.)
WE need to do shopping,today etc etc.
and..............
can you guess?
I am so so so tired.
We got home late from Bible study last night,
and I slept,
but not many hours ( maybe 3..... at most)
This little amount of sleep the past few weeks,
is starting to catch up to me.... in not the best way.
I will continue this study for sure,
just not sure about today!
I might do it tomorrow :)
Right now, I need to close my eyes for a few minutes :)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 7, 2022 12:45:41 GMT -5
Cindy, you mentioned how a person can actually be proud,
when stating they are the worst of the worst sinners.
I agree, and have fallen into that myself in the past.
In fact, a person can even get to the point where they are actually saying, they are so bad, that even God cannot save or help them.....
That is a huge amount of pride really!
It is still a type of boasting and feeling superior to other people. We are still trying to 'one up' other people, they may be bad, but we are the worst!
That is a deep falsehood, to imagine yourself, so powerful, that even God cannot help you!
Thinking yourself more powerful than God....that is a huge amount of pride!
It is also an excuse, for staying in our sins.
And either demonstration of pride,
( thinking and feeling we are so much better than others,
or thinking you are the worst of all the worsts)...
sets us in opposition to God.
The wicked, in the haughtiness of his countenance, does not seek Him.
All his thoughts are, “There is no God.
Psalms 10:4
Either type of pride and boasting is falsehood.
We are telling ourselves lies, and the result is tragic.
Like clouds and wind without rain
Is a man who boasts of his gifts falsely.
Proverbs 25:14
and
Thus says the Lord,
“Let not a wise man boast of his wisdom,
and let not the mighty man boast of his might,
let not a rich man boast of his riches
Jeremiah 9:23
The boastful shall not stand before Your eyes;
You hate all who do iniquity.
Psalm 5:5
Rather our boasting should be this:
My soul will make its boast in the Lord;
The humble will hear it and rejoice
Psalm 34:2
and
But he gives us more grace.
That is why Scripture says:
“God opposes the proud
but shows favor to the humble.
James 4:6
This does not mean, one has to lie about what is true in their life,
but even your gifts are from God,
so you are not conceited, and can remain humbled and blessed.
Pride goes before destruction,
And a haughty spirit before stumbling.
It is better to be humble in spirit with the lowly...
Proverbs 16:18,19
Done for today
still having sleep issues, hope this even made sense
Off to a doctor's appointment
and then a nap :)
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Post by Cindy on Mar 8, 2022 7:41:52 GMT -5
very good!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 8, 2022 12:04:15 GMT -5
What are some of the other detriments of pride.
Someone in the secular world, might think that pride stimulates competition,
and they mistakenly see that as a good thing.
The idea being if two people compete,
it pushes them to a higher level of excellence.
But there are some major downfalls with that.
If two people filled with pride, are trying to be the best,
they are not working together to solve a problem or find a solution.
This lack of unity, may mean it takes longer to reach a goal,
because they may each have a part of the puzzle the other does not have.
Pride can kill unity so things like this become harder or not even possible:
Also in Judah the hand of God was on the people
to give them unity of mind
to carry out what the king and his officials had ordered,
following the word of the Lord.
2 Chronicles 30:12
And of course, competition is not usually a happy, loving situation
unlike:
How good and pleasant it is
when God’s people live together in unity!
Psalm 133:1
and
Make every effort
to keep the unity of the Spirit
through the bond of peace.
Ephesians 4:3
also
until we all reach unity in the faith
and in the knowledge of the Son of God
and become mature,
attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.
Ephesians 4:13
Proud thoughts, pride and competition
does not accomplish this:
Therefore encourage one another
and build each other up,....
1 Thessalonians 5:11
Prideful thoughts ranks people,
and places them in an unloving pecking order.
Who is better than who?
There is little love of Christ in that kind of thinking.
Let no debt remain outstanding,
except the continuing debt to love one another,
for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law.
Romans 13:8
A proud believer might have all these but without love....
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels,
but do not have love,
I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.
2 If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge,
and if I have a faith that can move mountains,
but do not have love, I am nothing.
3 If I give all I possess to the poor
and give over my body to hardship that I may boast,
but do not have love, I gain nothing.
1 Corinthians 13:1-3
I may add a bit more on this type of thought that needs to be taken captive tomorrow.
Done for Today.
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Post by Cindy on Mar 9, 2022 11:25:24 GMT -5
Good one Barbara! It's a real eye opener for us when we realize that pride is a sin, because we're programed to be proud of ourselves, and to tell others we're proud of them. We're told we're wrong, or bad not to do that, and that being proud is a good thing. It's really amazing how Satan has manipulated the worldview to be the complete opposite of what the Lord says. When I realized that, I also realized that when the world thought I was good or in some way applauded me, then I had to be living like an unsaved person and not like I should be. When the world likes me, I'm not living my faith. They can like what I've done, for example during a pandemic in the past, it was the Christians who cared for the sick because the rest of the population were too afraid to die so they wouldn't help those who got sick. The people were grateful, for the care of the Christians, but notice that it's very hard to find in history books that it was the Christians who did that. It's like so many things of God, there's a tension between two things that we tend to think are opposite. The world hates us, but at the same time the world often loves what we do or wants what we have. They see we're not afraid of dying and that makes them curious, or perhaps see that we don't worry about things or get anxious, because we know our Lord is in control and watching over us, and they want that peace we have.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 9, 2022 11:53:58 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy, what you wrote is so true!
It really is astounding how Satan has made pride such an important thing. And of course, that was as is one of his major flaws.
I find it mind boggling that Satan really believes he can dethrone God. Did he create the universe? Does he not know God created even the powerful angels?
I am beginning to think pride can literally cause such falsehood,and craziness, that a human or an angel can believe absolute fiction, as fact or truth. It is God who gave men and angels their gifts of strength, wisdom, beauty, etc. These things are 'gifts', not really something we own by ourselves, so that we can be proud.
There is no way, a created being,
can overcome the Creator of everything.
The Creator of time. space, life etc.
If pride caused so many angels to fall, into completely depravity, then I think, that is a major danger sign of something to avoid.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 9, 2022 15:57:17 GMT -5
I am taking a lot of time on pride,
because it is such a destructive thought,
that needs to be taken captive,
and yet, it is being touted as a necessary character trait,
to cultivate in today's world.
“Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor.....
Ezekiel 28:17
Pride blinded some angels,
and has and continues to blind men
( and women)
into thinking what is impossible for them,
can be done without God.
The wicked in his pride persecutes the poor;
Let them be caught in the plots which they have devised.
Psalms 10:2
Beauty can become ugly,
when pride and a haughty spirit reigns.
Haughty eyes and a proud heart,
The lamp of the wicked, is sin.
Proverbs 21:4
But God does not approve of this attitude:
For the Lord of hosts will have a day of reckoning
Against everyone who is proud and lofty
And against everyone who is lifted up,
That he may be abased.
Isaiah 2:12
and
6 But He gives more grace. Therefore He says:
“God resists the proud,
But gives grace to the humble.”
James 4:6
Pride is vanity,
and it perverts our judgment
By pride comes nothing but strife,
But with the well-advised is wisdom.
Proverbs 13:10
I think it started with Satan
and the strife it occurred with his Creator.
Some people who think they know everything
are fueled by pride
The sluggard is wiser in his own eyes
Than seven men who can give a discreet answer.
Proverbs 26:16
These are all reasons to take prideful thoughts captive.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 10, 2022 12:44:43 GMT -5
If pride caused so many angels to fall, into completely depravity, then I think, that is a major danger sign of something to avoid.  That's so true! I just added that to my Bible! (I always put "Barbara said" at the start of the note so I don't forget where it came from.
I am taking a lot of time on pride,
because it is such a destructive thought,
that needs to be taken captive,
and yet, it is being touted as a necessary character trait,
to cultivate in today's world.
“Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor.....
Ezekiel 28:17
Pride blinded some angels,
and has and continues to blind men
( and women)
into thinking what is impossible for them,
can be done without God.
The wicked in his pride persecutes the poor;
Let them be caught in the plots which they have devised.
Psalms 10:2
Beauty can become ugly,
when pride and a haughty spirit reigns.
Haughty eyes and a proud heart,
The lamp of the wicked, is sin.
Proverbs 21:4
But God does not approve of this attitude:
For the Lord of hosts will have a day of reckoning
Against everyone who is proud and lofty
And against everyone who is lifted up,
That he may be abased.
Isaiah 2:12
and
6 But He gives more grace. Therefore He says:
“God resists the proud,
But gives grace to the humble.”
James 4:6
Pride is vanity,
and it perverts our judgment
By pride comes nothing but strife,
But with the well-advised is wisdom.
Proverbs 13:10
I think it started with Satan
and the strife it occurred with his Creator.
Some people who think they know everything
are fueled by pride
The sluggard is wiser in his own eyes
Than seven men who can give a discreet answer.
Proverbs 26:16
These are all reasons to take prideful thoughts captive.
Done for today
I'd like to throw a wrench in the works though, because of something I just saw in my Bible. I put "pride" into my search engine to find a verse that would be a good one to put your quote next to. In doing so I ran into some very interesting verses, accidentally. So I'll just quote them for you, and when and if you want to you can tell us what you think about them, ok? Feel free to just quote my post and then you can delete this part and just keep the scriptures to make it easier for you. And if you don't want to deal with these, that's ok too. Let me know and I'll just delete this post. 
“Now, brothers, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” Then you will not take pride in one man over against another.” (1 Corinthians 4:6)
“We are not trying to commend ourselves to you again, but are giving you an opportunity to take pride in us, so that you can answer those who take pride in what is seen rather than in what is in the heart.” (2 Corinthians 5:12)
“I have great confidence in you; I take great pride in you. I am greatly encouraged; in all our troubles my joy knows no bounds.” (2 Corinthians 7:4)
“Therefore show these men the proof of your love and the reason for our pride in you, so that the churches can see it.” (2 Corinthians 8:24)
“Each one should test his own actions. Then he can take pride in himself, without comparing himself to somebody else,” (Galatians 6:4)
“The brother in humble circumstances ought to take pride in his high position. But the one who is rich should take pride in his low position, because he will pass away like a wild flower.” (James 1:9–10)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 10, 2022 15:17:19 GMT -5
Oh thank you ever so much for searching out some more verses on pride. Yes! I would like to take a deeper look at them!
I know there are zillions of other thoughts we need to take captive (lustful thoughts, revengeful thoughts, etc. etc.
And I would like to look at them...
but pride is such a sin trap, there is more to it, than when I first considered it.
In fact, it can be easy to mostly dismiss it, by thinking,
well, I not really proud, boastful or arrogant so that does not really have much to do with me.
But I think we can deceive ourselves into thinking we are not prideful, and actually humble....because pride can be so deceptive.
So yes, thank you, I will hope to look at your verses staring tomorrow.
I did not sleep a wink last night and had an additional very very bad headache.
Since tonight is small group Bible study, I want to try and get a nap
( having done some Bible study earlier this morning around 4 -5)
This headache does not want to go away gracefully either....so I don't trust trying to do today's study online.
But yeah...thank you again for your suggestions, I love it!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 13, 2022 18:55:35 GMT -5
I want to look at the verses you suggested but first,
someone might say:
But I am really gifted in ( fill in the blank).
And indeed, you may very well be....
but the operative word is 'gifted'
but in the sense that ,
you have been given a 'gift' ....from God.
For who regards you as superior?
What do you have that you did not receive?
And if you did receive it,
why do you boast as if you had not received it?
1 Corinthians 4:7
Now to start looking at the verses you suggested
the first one today:
“Now, brothers, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit,
so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying,
“Do not go beyond what is written.”
Then you will not take pride in one man over against another.”
1 Corinthians 4:6
Being truly humble is very necessary in a Christians life.
I suspect, that all people have some desire to be considered 'special',
better than others, looked up to, but this is a deadly desire,
and lacking in love and unity.
In this verse we have the example of Paul and Apollos.
Many of God's chosen were humble men.
Abraham said he was but dust and ashes,
in other words,
Instead of boasting in pride, about how he was the greatest,
instead he says, he is nothing special:
And Abraham replied,
“Now behold, I have ventured to speak to the Lord,
although I am but dust and ashes.
Genesis 18:27
Jacob has become transformed from his youth,
and in his maturity says:
Jacob said, “O God of my father Abraham
and God of my father Isaac,
O Lord, who said to me,
‘Return to your country and to your relatives,
and I will prosper you,’
10 I am unworthy of all the lovingkindness
and of all the faithfulness which You have shown to Your servant;...
Genesis 32:9,10
One might think, Moses might be able to boast a bit,
he grew up in Pharaoh's court,
had the finest of educations, etc.
Instead, Moses says this to God:
But Moses said to God,
“Who am I,
that I should go to Pharaoh,
and that I should bring the sons of Israel out of Egypt?
Exodus 3:11
Gideon says to God:
He said to Him, “O Lord, how shall I deliver Israel?
Behold, my family is the least in Manasseh,
and I am the youngest in my father’s house
Judges 6:15
John the Baptist says this speaking of himself in relation to Jesus:
It is He ( Jesus)
who comes after me ,
the thong of whose sandal I am not worthy to untie.”
John 1:27
And there were many others with the same attitude though they did great things,
were great leaders etc.
However the greatest example was Jesus:
but ( Jesus) emptied Himself,
taking the form of a bond-servant,
and being made in the likeness of men
Philippians 2:7
If we look at his life, from His birth to His death,
we see how He humbled Himself.
If anyone could have boasted truthfully
in pride of all His perfect attributes,
it was Jesus,
but that is not what He did in His life on earth.
“The brother in humble circumstances ought to take pride in his high position.
But the one who is rich should take pride in his low position,
because he will pass away like a wild flower.” (James 1:9–10)
Rather than boasting about who is the best,
( we are not choosing which is the best football team),
instead, we can honor all 'godly' pastors.
We may love a certain pastor who teaches us so much out of the Bible,
the trap is, we have to be careful, not to turn him into an idol,
and worse, into so great an idol, we ignore, and are critical of
all other 'godly' pastors.
This type of idolatry, can lead to boasting, pride arrogance, hostility, etc.
My pastor is so so much better than yours!
Therefore, I am in the superior group and I am therefore superior also.
Clearly this does not hold for false teachers,
but even so, we can pray for them.
For through the grace given to me
I say to everyone among you
not to think more highly of himself
than he ought to think;
but to think so as to have sound judgment,
as God has allotted to each a measure of faith.
Romans 12:3
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 14, 2022 9:26:17 GMT -5
That was great Barbara, thank you!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 14, 2022 17:16:01 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy.
I will work on the 2nd verse....prayerfully tomorrow....today is another sleepy day.
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Post by Cindy on Mar 15, 2022 9:49:57 GMT -5
Hope you're feeling better today!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 15, 2022 14:10:57 GMT -5
Actually aa mostly no sleep night....still, I will attempt another verse....if it seems hazy or wrong
well....I ask for forgiveness ahead of time. sigh I am beginning to give up on proper sleep.
like I said before.....
I am either awake at night, and nodding off all day
Or just sleeping day and night ( but not feeling rested even so) bummer!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 15, 2022 14:41:01 GMT -5
I am looking today, at the next verse you suggested :)
“We are not trying to commend ourselves to you again,
but are giving you an opportunity to take pride in us,
so that you can answer those who take pride
in what is seen rather
than in what is in the heart.”
(2 Corinthians 5:12)
This seems to be a slightly different take on pride,
to me it appears not be be a 'boasting pride,
simply honesty.
I am of the opinion Paul was a humble man,
an honest man, and more than that, a godly man....
and thus he had enemies. He is they very type of man,
Satan abhors, and so the devil uses his human slaves and minions,
to do everything,
to attack the character, decency, honesty and morals of the apostle Paul.
This is why Paul has to defend himself
( the last thing in the world he would want to do!).
In fact, he never claims to be 'perfect':
Not that I have already attained,
or am already perfected;
but I press on,
that I may lay hold of that
for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me
Philippians 3:12
On the other hand, people ( Christians),
may sometimes adopted a false humbleness,
and in doing so, deny the very 'gifts'
God has given them.
And that too is a sin, and those dishonest,
even lying thoughts,
also need to be taken captive.
Paul is not a hypocrite,
one who parades around,
pretending to be something
he ( or she) is not.
For it is not he who commends himself
that is approved,
but he whom the Lord commends.
2 Corinthians 10:18
However, Paul is saying,
the church needs to know and believe
in his honesty, and integrity,
so when false teachers try to take over,
they can answer them with the truth about Paul.
He who speaks truth tells what is right,
But a false witness, deceit.
Proverbs 12:17
They need to be able to defend Paul.
The truth matters:
O Lord, who may abide in Your tent?
Who may dwell on Your holy hill?
2 He who walks with integrity,
and works righteousness,
And speaks truth in his heart.
Psalm 15:1-2
and
and you will know the truth,
and the truth will make you free.
John 8:32
It was not just Paul, that the devil went after,
his human slaves, accused Jesus of being an alcoholic
The Son of Man came eating and drinking,
and they say,
‘Behold, a gluttonous man
and a drunkard,
a friend of tax collectors and sinners!’
Yet wisdom is vindicated by her deeds
Matthew 11:19
Not only that Jesus own family said,
he was crazy:
21 When His own people heard of this,
they went out to take custody of Him;
for they were saying, “He has lost His senses
Mark 3:21
And even worse, the Jews said,
Jesus had a demon.
19 A division occurred again among the Jews because of these words.
20 Many of them were saying, “He has a demon and is insane.
Why do you listen to Him?”
21 Others were saying,
“These are not the sayings of one demon-possessed.
A demon cannot open the eyes of the blind, can he?
John 10:19-21
people need to know, the absolute truth!
Because Satan, the devil is a liar:
You are of your father the devil,
and you want to do the desires of your father.
He was a murderer from the beginning,
and does not stand in the truth
because there is no truth in him.
Whenever he speaks a lie,
he speaks from his own nature,
for he is a liar and the father of lies.
John 8:44
So it's worth repeating:
and you will know the truth,
and the truth will make you free.
John 8:32
Paul is not boasting in the verse,
but speaking the truth.
Done for today.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 21, 2022 14:02:07 GMT -5
Finally!
Onto the next verse, you suggested.
“I have great confidence in you;
I take great pride in you.
I am greatly encouraged;
in all our troubles my joy knows no bounds.”
2 Corinthians 7:4
I am thinking, perhaps the difference of the 'pride' expressed here,
is a different kind of 'pride:
not a pride that has to do with worldly accomplishments .
But this 'pride' is rather concerning, true spiritual growth,
in love, compassion, purity, becoming more like Jesus.
This is not the pride a parent has,
because of their child's great beauty,
accomplishments, gifts etc.
This is, I think, an honest assessment of a pastor,
who must give an account to God.
17 Obey your leaders and submit to them,
for they keep watch over your souls as those who will give an account.
Let them do this with joy and not with grief,
for this would be unprofitable for you.
Hebrews 13:17
Paul has evidence that they have followed
some of his teachings of what God has said,
and that had uplifted him, because he had been depressed.
6 But God, who comforts the depressed,
comforted us
by the coming of Titus;
7 and not only by his coming,
but also by the comfort with which he was comforted in you,
as he reported to us your longing, your mourning,
your zeal for me;
so that I rejoiced even more.
2 Corinthians 7:6,7
They had been generous to the poor saints of God.
He was proud of the kind hearts and generous spirits,
and their growth to be more loving and compassionate, like Jesus.
But this verse and situation,
also gives us another look at,
when we have thoughts,
that need to be taken captive, like:
'depressing' thoughts....
we need to take them captive, and replace them,
with godly, uplifting ones.
Also, we ought not to boldly praise ourselves
but rather let other people praise us,
(if the so choose),
and if, it is factual, honest and true.
Let another praise you, and not your own mouth;
A stranger, and not your own lips.
Proverbs 27:2
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 24, 2022 12:39:59 GMT -5
True, but how can we know the difference today? I mean, we know Paul was telling the Truth and not boasting because the Bible says so, but it doesn't tell us if Sue, Bob, Jill or Melvin is boasting or not. See what I mean?
I loved what you said though. It made me think of this portion of scripture: Matthew 23:5-32, where Jesus tells people what the Pharisees think and say about themselves and what they really are.
There is one thing I'm not sure about though. It's absolutely true that the people (and us too) need to know the truth, but I'm not sure that they need to know & believe in Paul's honesty so much as that they need to know and believe in what God's Word says.
I think, in this case, it might be better to look at the entire section of the scripture you started with, rather than just picking verses that seem to agree with each other. Could we do that? I mean study and discuss 2 Corinthians 10:1–18? What do you think?
I'm sorry I haven't been here daily this week, but it's been crazy. It seems like I either can't sleep at night and wind up sleeping till 9am or else I wind up with company most of the day, or have doctor appointments. Hopefully things will settle down some now.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 24, 2022 14:00:53 GMT -5
True, but how can we know the difference today? I mean, we know Paul was telling the Truth and not boasting because the Bible says so, but it doesn't tell us if Sue, Bob, Jill or Melvin is boasting or not. See what I mean?
I loved what you said though. It made me think of this portion of scripture: Matthew 23:5-32, where Jesus tells people what the Pharisees think and say about themselves and what they really are.
There is one thing I'm not sure about though. It's absolutely true that the people (and us too) need to know the truth, but I'm not sure that they need to know & believe in Paul's honesty so much as that they need to know and believe in what God's Word says.
I think, in this case, it might be better to look at the entire section of the scripture you started with, rather than just picking verses that seem to agree with each other. Could we do that? I mean study and discuss 2 Corinthians 10:1–18? What do you think?
Yes, I can do that....I am not sure if that ( 2 Corinthians 10:1-18) was part of the list of verses you posted
that I was SLOWLY working thru)
( I think I only got thru 3 of them....)
because I like you have been either not sleeping all night and sleeping all day
( no sleep last night for example)
or, all manner of unscheduled, not planned etc. thing come up and take up most of the day sigh!
So, I am thinking,
you mean either:
don't finish the original list of verses you posted awhile back....
or.....
use them,
but in more complete sections...like the whole chapter in some cases?
But in any case,
I should start with the 2 Corinthians 10: 1-18
Since, it is a bigger chunk of verses...
18 verses to be exact...instead of just one verse,
and
I did not sleep last night
and
today is a busy busy day and night ( 3-4 hour small group Bible study)
I will wait until tomorrow....
Prayerfully, I will sleep tonight....
maybe,
hope hope....
God willing
or
maybe God will want me to pray all night, like last night
Anyway,
you maybe will have a chance, to confirm,tomorrow
if I truly understand what you are suggesting.
Oh....and should I also try and
answer the first question in this post of yours?
I'm sorry I haven't been here daily this week, but it's been crazy. It seems like I either can't sleep at night and wind up sleeping till 9am or else I wind up with company most of the day, or have doctor appointments. Hopefully things will settle down some now. |
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Post by Cindy on Mar 25, 2022 10:35:19 GMT -5
No hon. I just meant to ask if you would look at the entire section of the scripture you started with, which was 2 Corinthians 10:18, rather than just picking verses that seem to agree with each other. I mean study and discuss 2 Corinthians 10:1–18. Then, after we have looked at this section of verses about pride, then pick up where you left off, (if you want to). OK?
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 25, 2022 12:24:57 GMT -5
Aha! Good thing I waited to clear that up!
I will do so...I will try to look at it a bit today
however we did not get home until almost ten last night
( which for me is equivalent to being a teen and coming home at 4 in the morning eeekkkkkk
I slept a 'little' but am super super tired today, falling asleep and waking up
nevertheless....I will do my best to get a start on it today, and work also on it tomorrow.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 8,383
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Post by fearnot on Mar 25, 2022 12:32:27 GMT -5
I am going to be looking at this passage today and most likely tomorrow, and Sunday, perhaps even Monday.
Now I, Paul, myself urge you by the meekness and gentleness of Christ—
I who am meek when face to face with you,
but bold toward you when absent!
2 I ask that when I am present I need not be bold with the confidence with which I propose to be courageous against some,
who regard us as if we walked according to the flesh.
3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh,
4 for the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh,
but divinely powerful for the destruction of fortresses.
5 We are destroying speculations and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ,
6 and we are ready to punish all disobedience, whenever your obedience is complete.
7 You are looking at things as they are outwardly.
If anyone is confident in himself that he is Christ’s,
let him consider this again within himself,
that just as he is Christ’s,
so also are we.
8 For even if I boast somewhat further about our authority,
which the Lord gave for building you up and not for destroying you,
I will not be put to shame,
9 for I do not wish to seem as if I would terrify you by my letters.
10 For they say, “His letters are weighty and strong,
but his personal presence is unimpressive and his speech contemptible.”
11 Let such a person consider this,
that what we are in word by letters when absent,
such persons we are also in deed when present.
12 For we are not bold to class or compare ourselves with some of those who commend themselves;
but when they measure themselves by themselves and compare themselves with themselves,
they are without understanding.
13 But we will not boast beyond our measure,
but within the measure of the sphere which God apportioned to us as a measure,
to reach even as far as you.
14 For we are not overextending ourselves, as if we did not reach to you,
for we were the first to come even as far as you in the gospel of Christ;
15 not boasting beyond our measure,
that is, in other men’s labors,
but with the hope that as your faith grows,
we will be, within our sphere, enlarged even more by you,
16 so as to preach the gospel even to the regions beyond you,
and not to boast in what has been accomplished in the sphere of another.
17 But he who boasts is to boast in the Lord.
18 For it is not he who commends himself that is approved,
but he whom the Lord commends.
2 Corinthians 10:1–18
I was exhausted today, and mostly slept, and am still sleepy.
However, so far I have read this passage over twice,
and underlined some words that jumped out at me.
They seem to resolve around 'warfare' and also something about boasting mentioned about 5 times.
And also the very verse, that is what pertains to this Bible study:
the 'taking every thought captive'.
Which is a main stay, I believe,
in spiritual warfare and battles.
The apostle Paul certainly knew a LOT about 'battles'
especially spiritual battles!
But never for self glorification, beating his own chest,
to show what a grand warrior he was.
It seems like there were always 'wolves',
false hostile jealous teachers, who even plotted to kill him.
Paul had many many physical scars,
that came as a result of this never ending struggle,
but also spiritual wounds.
In this letter, the apostle talks of his weapons of spiritual warfare,
and this can be a great example for us, as how to fight.
In general, most people only think soldiers are strong and brutal,
but that is not so, many of the best, have much compassion.
As when Paul starts this passage:
1 Now I, Paul, myself urge you by the meekness and gentleness of Christ—
I who am meek when face to face with you.
I will come back to this tomorrow.
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Mar 26, 2022 10:38:59 GMT -5
I'm afraid I've got to run today to do the shopping. Be back on Monday!
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That's so true! I just added that to my Bible! (I always put "Barbara said" at the start of the note so I don't forget where it came from. 
!!
