fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168 
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Post by fearnot on Dec 8, 2020 14:07:48 GMT -5
Yes, I see what you mean....there was only one thing I was confused about LOL
I did not say:
“I want to tell everybody, you’re not getting the 666 in this vaccine, OK?”
Bill De Blasio said that.
So I couldn't really change his quote right?
I was just saying it seemed weird that he would be saying that.
I think the idea was to stop fears about it...
But he is so anti-Christian
why would he go to a church,
and say that there
why not just have a news conference?
When he does not even want churches open!
And why bring up 666, its a marginal conspiracy about this vaccine.
It's true there have been some weird conspiracies trying to say it is the mark
because of it's have 3 sixes in the patent,
and so on...
but how many people would even know about those?
There are however other scientists etc. who have some concerns about the vaccine,
and some religious people have concerns based on several other aspects like:
it's designed to change the RNA in your body so that every cell in your body then has been changed to be able to fight the corona virus.
That is worrisome to some clergy because it
seems'
to be changing the design of God ( I think that is the idea)
( and its not clear that is even factual or true about the virus....but it is what some are worried about.)
And I did a search about aborted fetus cells being used
it was absolutely amazing
the sites that came up
scrolling down
basically it went like:
YES! absolutely
NO! absolutely NOT
YES absolutely
NO absolutely NOT
YES absolutely
NO
YES
NO
YES
NO
In a world now, where the truth is getting harder to discern about such things.
People are diving strongly about many many things.
It would seem even scientists are divided when on Laura Ingraham's Fox news a renowned scientist says this:
Renowned scientist tells Laura Ingraham the COVID-19 vaccine is 'downright dangerous' and will send you 'to your doom'
He 'seems' to be a real scientist:
He studied medicine at the University of Bonn in Germany,
where he received his MD in 1970.
He was a post-doctoral researcher
at the Max Planck Institute of Immunobiology and Epigenetics in Freiburg from 1972 to 1976,
and at The Protein Laboratory in Copenhagen from 1976 to 1977.
He joined the Institute of Medical Microbiology at Giessen University in 1977 and was appointed associate professor in 1982.
He was named chair of Medical Microbiology at the University of Mainz in 1990,
where he remained until his retirement in 2012.
Dr. Bhakdi has published over three hundred articles in the fields of
immunology,
bacteriology,
virology,
and parasitology,
for which he has received numerous awards and the Order of Merit of Rhineland-Palatinate.
www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/12/reknowned_scientist_tells_laura_ingraham_the_covid19_vaccine_is_downright_dangerous_and_will_send_you_to_your_doom.html
But of course that is just one side of the debate
but there seems to be a debate?
And then there is the Mayor, talking about 666 |
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 8, 2020 14:48:28 GMT -5
I am thinking, that no matter where the virus actually came from
it's effects world wide have been massively destructive
on so many levels.
It has pushed the divide among people even further apart,
than they were already going.
Some people are so scared of dying,
they are willing to do almost anything,
and others.......
not so much.
Here is one news item
of the 'not so much' kind:
Virginia county board votes against Northam's coronavirus restrictions
"The Campbell County Board of Supervisors declared its county as a
“First Amendment Sanctuary” claiming
Northam’s restrictions violated constitutional rights.
NPR reports that the county made a similar move last year
when it declared itself a “Second Amendment Sanctuary.”
thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/528465-virginia-county-board-votes-against-northams-coronavirus-restrictions
Whether one applauds this,
or is in horror of it,
It does show
the point
there is a big divide among people....
and it seems to be a method of tearing
the very fabric of our society,
and even world,
apart.
And there was this yesterday:
Nancy Pelosi Admits That She Held Up COVID Stimulus For Months Just To Hurt Trump
Pelosi previously encountered criticism for not supporting a moderate Democratic proposal,
insisting on a much larger price tag.
The current proposal from the Problem Solvers Caucus, a group of 25 Republicans and 25 Democrats working to find bipartisan solutions, is $908 billion,
significantly less than the $1.5 trillion proposed before the election.
In October, the White House had also proposed a $1.8 trillion package,
roughly twice the size of the one Pelosi is now backing.
And tho the verse I will post
was for Christians
it seems like,
even Christians are greatly divided:
10 I appeal to you, brothers,
by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
that all of you agree,
and that there be no divisions among you,
but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.
I Corinthians 1:10
And also
we are in much confusion
about so many things
the pandemic has wrought
plus
things seem to change
from day to day
33 For God is not a God of confusion but of peace...
I Corinthians 14:33
And where do we find peace in all of this?
Jesus said:
27 Peace I leave with you;
my peace I give to you.
Not as the world gives do I give to you.
Let not your hearts be troubled,
neither let them be afraid.
John 14:27
And where does confusion and lies come from?
44 You are of your father the devil,
and your will is to do your father's desires.
He was a murderer from the beginning,
and does not stand in the truth,
because there is no truth in him.
When he lies,
he speaks out of his own character,
for he is a liar and the father of lies.
John 8:44
I think another possibility is
Christian persecution
to a larger degree in America
The coming of persecution for Christian Americans
www.christianpost.com/voices/the-coming-of-persecution-for-christian-americans.html
"The Washington Examiner reported that
Pastor Andrew Brunson said he was
“astounded at the speed with which the U.S. is imploding”
and that he predicts persecution of Christians will follow.
Brunson is the evangelical Presbyterian missionary to Turkey,
who spent two years in a Turkish prison.
“There are any number of issues
where it seems that it’s no longer enough
for a person of faith
to get along with,
or to serve,
or to treat well someone they disagree with.
And I think that the political business, media, celebrity class, and also academia,
it seems that there’s much more of a demand that people approve of,
that they validate, that they celebrate things that they actually disagree with".
Persecution has a way of making a genuine follower of Jesus Christ,
an individual of sturdy and profound faith.
www.christianpost.com/voices/the-coming-of-persecution-for-christian-americans.html
20 He who testifies to these things says,
“Surely I am coming soon.”
Amen.
Come, Lord Jesus!
Revelation 22:20
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Post by Cindy on Dec 9, 2020 12:19:55 GMT -5
I'm going to reply inside your post for now.
Yes, I see what you mean....there was only one thing I was confused about LOL
I did not say:
“I want to tell everybody, you’re not getting the 666 in this vaccine, OK?”
Bill De Blasio said that.
I'm aware of that hon. No, you couldn't change it but sometimes it's better not to say anything. It depends on who you're talking/writing to, and who could overhear you or read what you're saying. We always have to write or speak to those who may have the least amount of understanding.
So I couldn't really change his quote right?
I was just saying it seemed weird that he would be saying that.
I think the idea was to stop fears about it...
But he is so anti-Christian
why would he go to a church,
and say that there
why not just have a news conference?
When he does not even want churches open!
And why bring up 666, its a marginal conspiracy about this vaccine.
Why? that's easy. It's due to another thing that conspiracy theories do. it makes Christians look ridiculous and like we don't have a brain in our heads, and that's exactly what he was saying, and why he said it where he did.
It's true there have been some weird conspiracies trying to say it is the mark
because of it's have 3 sixes in the patent,
and so on...
Some? There are more conspiracy theories about the Mark of the beast then anything else. I doubt if anyone would even have time to read all the different ones. There's probably as many as there are people who have misunderstood that scripture over the centuries. I honestly can't count how many things I've heard so called "Christians" say was the precursor to the Mark or that it was the Mark.
but how many people would even know about those? Millions! In fact, I'd be willing to bet that more people know about the conspiracy theories then those who know what Scripture is really saying.
There are however other scientists etc. who have some concerns about the vaccine,
and some religious people have concerns based on several other aspects like:
it's designed to change the RNA in your body so that every cell in your body then has been changed to be able to fight the corona virus.
That is worrisome to some clergy because it
seems'
to be changing the design of God ( I think that is the idea)
( and its not clear that is even factual or true about the virus....but it is what some are worried about.)
And I did a search about aborted fetus cells being used
it was absolutely amazing
the sites that came up
scrolling down
basically it went like:
YES! absolutely
NO! absolutely NOT
YES absolutely
NO absolutely NOT
YES absolutely
NO
YES
NO
YES
NO
In a world now, where the truth is getting harder to discern about such things.
People are diving strongly about many many things.
all this stuff people are saying about the vaccines is just ridiculous to me and most of it is again conspiracy theory garbage. No one can know very much about the vaccines until the FDA gives the go ahead for them to be given to people in the US. Then people can go pick them apart and decide they're terrible. I have to laugh at those who do though, because if they knew what was in the meds they normally take without a thought, or especially the vitamins and supplements they take without thinking, they'd be appalled. Since they don't have the qualifications to make a vaccine themselves, why do they think they have the ability to understand whether or not they're harmful?
It would seem even scientists are divided when on Laura Ingraham's Fox news a renowned scientist says this:
Renowned scientist tells Laura Ingraham the COVID-19 vaccine is 'downright dangerous' and will send you 'to your doom'
He 'seems' to be a real scientist:
He studied medicine at the University of Bonn in Germany,
where he received his MD in 1970.
He was a post-doctoral researcher
at the Max Planck Institute of Immunobiology and Epigenetics in Freiburg from 1972 to 1976,
and at The Protein Laboratory in Copenhagen from 1976 to 1977.
He joined the Institute of Medical Microbiology at Giessen University in 1977 and was appointed associate professor in 1982.
He was named chair of Medical Microbiology at the University of Mainz in 1990,
where he remained until his retirement in 2012.
Dr. Bhakdi has published over three hundred articles in the fields of
immunology,
bacteriology,
virology,
and parasitology,
for which he has received numerous awards and the Order of Merit of Rhineland-Palatinate.
www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/12/reknowned_scientist_tells_laura_ingraham_the_covid19_vaccine_is_downright_dangerous_and_will_send_you_to_your_doom.html
But of course that is just one side of the debate
but there seems to be a debate?
And then there is the Mayor, talking about 666
Also consider what Satan's fruit and the fruit of those who belong to him is. I'm speaking of things like lying, murder, confusion, destruction, etc. Then look at the fruit of the spirit that comes from God. Those are the things that show us where people and their ideas and thoughts are coming from.
I am thinking, that no matter where the virus actually came from
it's effects world wide have been massively destructive
on so many levels.
It has pushed the divide among people even further apart,
than they were already going.
Some people are so scared of dying,
they are willing to do almost anything,
and others.......
not so much.
Here is one news item
of the 'not so much' kind:
Virginia county board votes against Northam's coronavirus restrictions
"The Campbell County Board of Supervisors declared its county as a
“First Amendment Sanctuary” claiming
Northam’s restrictions violated constitutional rights.
NPR reports that the county made a similar move last year
when it declared itself a “Second Amendment Sanctuary.”
thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/528465-virginia-county-board-votes-against-northams-coronavirus-restrictions
Whether one applauds this,
or is in horror of it,
It does show
the point
there is a big divide among people....
and it seems to be a method of tearing
the very fabric of our society,
and even world,
apart.
And there was this yesterday:
Nancy Pelosi Admits That She Held Up COVID Stimulus For Months Just To Hurt Trump
Pelosi previously encountered criticism for not supporting a moderate Democratic proposal,
insisting on a much larger price tag.
The current proposal from the Problem Solvers Caucus, a group of 25 Republicans and 25 Democrats working to find bipartisan solutions, is $908 billion,
significantly less than the $1.5 trillion proposed before the election.
In October, the White House had also proposed a $1.8 trillion package,
roughly twice the size of the one Pelosi is now backing.
And tho the verse I will post
was for Christians
it seems like,
even Christians are greatly divided:
10 I appeal to you, brothers,
by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
that all of you agree,
and that there be no divisions among you,
but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.
I Corinthians 1:10
And also
we are in much confusion
about so many things
the pandemic has wrought
plus
things seem to change
from day to day
33 For God is not a God of confusion but of peace...
I Corinthians 14:33
And where do we find peace in all of this?
Jesus said:
27 Peace I leave with you;
my peace I give to you.
Not as the world gives do I give to you.
Let not your hearts be troubled,
neither let them be afraid.
John 14:27
And where does confusion and lies come from?
44 You are of your father the devil,
and your will is to do your father's desires.
He was a murderer from the beginning,
and does not stand in the truth,
because there is no truth in him.
When he lies,
he speaks out of his own character,
for he is a liar and the father of lies.
John 8:44
Exactly!!!!!! 
I think another possibility is
Christian persecution
to a larger degree in America
The coming of persecution for Christian Americans
www.christianpost.com/voices/the-coming-of-persecution-for-christian-americans.html
"The Washington Examiner reported that
Pastor Andrew Brunson said he was
“astounded at the speed with which the U.S. is imploding”
and that he predicts persecution of Christians will follow.
Brunson is the evangelical Presbyterian missionary to Turkey,
who spent two years in a Turkish prison.
“There are any number of issues
where it seems that it’s no longer enough
for a person of faith
to get along with,
or to serve,
or to treat well someone they disagree with.
And I think that the political business, media, celebrity class, and also academia,
it seems that there’s much more of a demand that people approve of,
that they validate, that they celebrate things that they actually disagree with".
Persecution has a way of making a genuine follower of Jesus Christ,
an individual of sturdy and profound faith.
www.christianpost.com/voices/the-coming-of-persecution-for-christian-americans.html
20 He who testifies to these things says,
“Surely I am coming soon.”
Amen.
Come, Lord Jesus!
Revelation 22:20
 You're dong great hon, and I've very much enjoy reading what you write. I hope you don't mind my hints and sometimes my corrections. But you're a very good teacher and I want to help you be the very best you can be!
Yes, there will be some persecution, but I'm not sure about it getting really bad like it is in other countries. We know that will happen during the Tribulation, but the main reason I don't think it will happen before the rapture is because the more the Church is persecuted and the stronger the persecution is, the more the Church grows and is purified. It often causes large numbers of people to become saved, as strange as that sounds. I guess it's because it becomes very obvious who the true Christians are and our lives become so very different then the way the rest of the world lives and believes that everyone can see that our faith is the only true way to heaven, and to peace and love here and now. So while we will get some persecution, I don't think it will get all that bad while we're here, since the end of this age is one during which there is a great falling away from the church. It's not until the tribulation that the church will be purified and have a huge growth spurt again. Of course, I could be wrong, but that's how I understand scripture at this point. If you're aware of scripture that would say otherwise, please let me know as I'm aware I don't know it all! lol
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 9, 2020 12:50:05 GMT -5
So here is a bit of Covid vaccine news...potentially:
New York legislation could make COVID-19 vaccination mandatory
www.fox5ny.com/news/new-york-legislation-would-make-covid-19-vaccination-mandatory
We know what the prevailing measures are for Covid 19,
but not all
Doctors, scientists, epidemiologists
agree with them.
Here is just one of many:
A Sensible and Compassionate Anti-COVID Strategy
Jay Bhattacharya is a Professor of Medicine at Stanford University,
where he received both an M.D.
and a Ph.D. in economics.
He is also a research associate at the National Bureau of Economics Research,
a senior fellow at the Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research
and at the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies,
and director of the Stanford Center on the Demography and Economics of Health and Aging.
"In discussing the deadliness of COVID,
we need to distinguish COVID cases
from COVID infections.
A lot of fear and confusion has resulted from failing to understand the difference".
imprimis.hillsdale.edu/sensible-compassionate-anti-covid-strategy/
Truthfully, I have moments,
when I would just prefer to stick my head in the sand...
No wait.....
not that! LOL
Rather,
I would turn over and continuing sleeping
and hope all this chaos
and confusion
and violence...
will just go away!
A little sleep, a little slumber,
a little folding of the hands to rest,
Proverbs 6:10
But instead, I need to do this:
The Lord is my strength and my shield;
in him my heart trusts,
and I am helped;
my heart exults,
and with my song I give thanks to him.
Psalm 28:7
and remember this:
28 And we know
that for those who love God
all things work together for good,
for those who are called
according to his purpose.
Romans 8:28
On the other hand,
there is also a part of me that
is amazed and excited even,
( because the Bible predicted
the End Times
and following Tribulation,
(after the Rapture)
would be 'rocky'
to say the least, and only get worse)
As totally unique events
of Biblical proportions continue to happen....
For example:
I don't think
that the world
has ever completely shut down,
or
the whole world,
(every country)
in the past,
all wore masks
etc. etc.
It is almost to the point,
where each day, I wake up
something fairly new, scary, unique
weird, troublesome, chaotic etc.
will have happened over night,
or is happening at that very moment...
It's almost
like multiple Moses days
Starting with this LOL
30 “Now when forty years had passed,
an angel appeared to him in the wilderness of Mount Sinai,
in a flame of fire in a bush.
31 When Moses saw it,
he was amazed at the sight,
and as he drew near to look,
there came the voice of the Lord:
32 ‘I am the God of your fathers,
the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob.’
And Moses trembled and did not dare to look.
Acts 7:30-32
But we Christians can rest,
because although the world is
going thru major upheavals,
and many more of them
are around every corner....
We know this:
6 “For I the Lord do not change; ...
Malachi 3:6
and this:
8 Jesus Christ is
the same yesterday
and today
and forever.
Hebrews 13:8
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 9, 2020 14:54:25 GMT -5
That was a perfect answer to my question
Of course!!!
He said it to make Christians look stupid! duh!
Why didn't I think of that
As soon as a I read it, I thought
OF course!
That's it!!!
Pride, and scorn make themselves bedfellows!
I do understand what you mean about
sometimes its best not to say anything.
And I will work on that....
But I sometimes have some problems with that
For example:
In public schools
Creation Science is not even allowed to be discussed....
Because,
in a way,
most science teachers
view Creation Science,
sort of
like a conspiracy ....
At best they demean it as:
'religion'.....
that has no place in the 'true' science realm
nor
to be talked about in a 'science class'.
But I understand, most conspiracy theories
are false, and lies...
which cause confusion
and
harm
However, I really do believe there have been some conspiracy theories
that turned out to be the truth
and
what was called rock solid truth
was wrong
and not the truth
and/or
a lie.
I for sure do not think the vaccine is the mark of the beast
for one thing that
will not happen until after the rapture,
and during the tribulation....
neither of which has yet happened...
But I am not 100 % comfortable
personally
with the vaccine,
at this point.
And I do not wish to confuse people
but I have also a bit of trouble
with 'censorship'
in that even mentioning
a conspiracy
should never be brought up
I am not saying you said that tho!!!
I am just trying to be on the straight and narrow
and do
and
write
in a way God is glorified.
So I am saying that about be careful
concerning conspiracies and censoring or not bringing them into
a Bible study
Because I need
to get more of your help
in that area
Do you ever think a conspiracy
is the truth?
I don't expect it to be often...
but for example
I think Creation science
is the truth...
I believe God is the Creator of the universe
and all life
and
it was not done over millions
or
billions of years
( However long the 'scientists'
are saying it took....
Sometimes to me it seems like
the 'time' of the 'Big Bang"
and accidental life forming
changes almost day to day
So to me that is what some call
conspiracy ( Creation Science)
that I believe is actually the True Truth...
and what they ( scientists ) call truth....
scientific truth
is the real fairy tale!
However,
I know as Christians we are to be 'truth tellers'
and not
false conspiracy folk
8 Finally, brothers,
whatever is true,
whatever is honorable,
whatever is just,
whatever is pure,
whatever is lovely,
whatever is commendable,
if there is any excellence,
if there is anything worthy of praise,
think about these things.
Philippians 4:8
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Post by Cindy on Dec 10, 2020 11:40:46 GMT -5
So here is a bit of Covid vaccine news...potentially:
New York legislation could make COVID-19 vaccination mandatory
www.fox5ny.com/news/new-york-legislation-would-make-covid-19-vaccination-mandatory
We know what the prevailing measures are for Covid 19,
but not all
Doctors, scientists, epidemiologists
agree with them.
Here is just one of many:
A Sensible and Compassionate Anti-COVID Strategy
Jay Bhattacharya is a Professor of Medicine at Stanford University,
where he received both an M.D.
and a Ph.D. in economics.
He is also a research associate at the National Bureau of Economics Research,
a senior fellow at the Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research
and at the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies,
and director of the Stanford Center on the Demography and Economics of Health and Aging.
"In discussing the deadliness of COVID,
we need to distinguish COVID cases
from COVID infections.
A lot of fear and confusion has resulted from failing to understand the difference".
imprimis.hillsdale.edu/sensible-compassionate-anti-covid-strategy/
Truthfully, I have moments,
when I would just prefer to stick my head in the sand...
No wait.....
not that! LOL
Rather,
I would turn over and continuing sleeping
and hope all this chaos
and confusion
and violence...
will just go away!
A little sleep, a little slumber,
a little folding of the hands to rest,
Proverbs 6:10
But instead, I need to do this:
The Lord is my strength and my shield;
in him my heart trusts,
and I am helped;
my heart exults,
and with my song I give thanks to him.
Psalm 28:7
and remember this:
28 And we know
that for those who love God
all things work together for good,
for those who are called
according to his purpose.
Romans 8:28
On the other hand,
there is also a part of me that
is amazed and excited even,
( because the Bible predicted
the End Times
and following Tribulation,
(after the Rapture)
would be 'rocky'
to say the least, and only get worse)
As totally unique events
of Biblical proportions continue to happen....
For example:
I don't think
that the world
has ever completely shut down,
or
the whole world,
(every country)
in the past,
all wore masks
etc. etc.
It is almost to the point,
where each day, I wake up
something fairly new, scary, unique
weird, troublesome, chaotic etc.
will have happened over night,
or is happening at that very moment...
It's almost
like multiple Moses days
Starting with this LOL
30 “Now when forty years had passed,
an angel appeared to him in the wilderness of Mount Sinai,
in a flame of fire in a bush.
31 When Moses saw it,
he was amazed at the sight,
and as he drew near to look,
there came the voice of the Lord:
32 ‘I am the God of your fathers,
the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob.’
And Moses trembled and did not dare to look.
Acts 7:30-32
But we Christians can rest,
because although the world is
going thru major upheavals,
and many more of them
are around every corner....
We know this:
6 “For I the Lord do not change; ...
Malachi 3:6
and this:
8 Jesus Christ is
the same yesterday
and today
and forever.
Hebrews 13:8
That was a perfect answer to my question
Of course!!!
He said it to make Christians look stupid! duh!
Why didn't I think of that
As soon as a I read it, I thought
OF course!
That's it!!!
Pride, and scorn make themselves bedfellows!
I do understand what you mean about
sometimes its best not to say anything.
And I will work on that....
But I sometimes have some problems with that
For example:
In public schools
Creation Science is not even allowed to be discussed....
Because,
in a way,
most science teachers
view Creation Science,
sort of
like a conspiracy ....
At best they demean it as:
'religion'.....
that has no place in the 'true' science realm
nor
to be talked about in a 'science class'.
But I understand, most conspiracy theories
are false, and lies...
which cause confusion
and
harm
However, I really do believe there have been some conspiracy theories
that turned out to be the truth
and
what was called rock solid truth
was wrong
and not the truth
and/or
a lie.
I for sure do not think the vaccine is the mark of the beast
for one thing that
will not happen until after the rapture,
and during the tribulation....
neither of which has yet happened...
But I am not 100 % comfortable
personally
with the vaccine,
at this point.
And I do not wish to confuse people
but I have also a bit of trouble
with 'censorship'
in that even mentioning
a conspiracy
should never be brought up
I am not saying you said that tho!!!
I am just trying to be on the straight and narrow
and do
and
write
in a way God is glorified.
So I am saying that about be careful
concerning conspiracies and censoring or not bringing them into
a Bible study
Because I need
to get more of your help
in that area
Do you ever think a conspiracy
is the truth?
I don't expect it to be often...
but for example
I think Creation science
is the truth...
I believe God is the Creator of the universe
and all life
and
it was not done over millions
or
billions of years
( However long the 'scientists'
are saying it took....
Sometimes to me it seems like
the 'time' of the 'Big Bang"
and accidental life forming
changes almost day to day
So to me that is what some call
conspiracy ( Creation Science)
that I believe is actually the True Truth...
and what they ( scientists ) call truth....
scientific truth
is the real fairy tale!
However,
I know as Christians we are to be 'truth tellers'
and not
false conspiracy folk
8 Finally, brothers,
whatever is true,
whatever is honorable,
whatever is just,
whatever is pure,
whatever is lovely,
whatever is commendable,
if there is any excellence,
if there is anything worthy of praise,
think about these things.
Philippians 4:8 
No conspiracy theory has ever "come true" to my knowledge. If they did, then they wouldn't be a conspiracy theory. (like my example of the sun.) So which ones do you believe have come true? Keep in mind however that like everything Satan does, all conspiracy theories start out with bits of truth in them to pull people in. That's what Bible means when it says that “... Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.” (2 Corinthians 11:14)
When MacArthur says about this verse that Satan "masquerades as an angel of light—that is, deceptively, disguised as a messenger of truth" he's not talking about Satan putting on a costume to make himself look like a pastor or something like that. He means that Satan mixes lies in with the truth. He usually starts with some truth and then begins to twist the meaning to something he knows the person or group would like. For example he might start out with the scripture about divorce, but then twist it so that anyone can divorce for any reason. (and in fact he has done that!) It's the same with conspiracy theories.
There are quite literally hundred (If not thousands) of scriptures in both the old and new testament that tell us what our speech should be like, what kind of things we should speak about, and what kind of things we shouldn't speak about. Going deeper there are just as many telling us the kind of thoughts that can be allowed into our minds and the kind that shouldn't be allowed in to stay. (I know you're aware of this.  ) For example, “Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord, always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.” (Ephesians 5:19–20)
and “Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God.” (Colossians 3:16)
We need to keep these scriptures especially in mind when we're writing about God and His Word: (especially this first one!) “Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.” (James 3:1)
“But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned.”” (Matthew 12:36–37)
and “The heart of the righteous weighs its answers, but the mouth of the wicked gushes evil.” (Proverbs 15:28)
Yes, we do have freedom of speech, but because we no longer live for ourselves, but for God, we must be careful to speak (and write) what He would have us write, and not what we think is good. It's like our freedom of speech law. We can pretty much say anything we want about anyone or anything, although if we speak lies about a person, that person can sue us for it, and no one who is inside any building can scream "fire!" because that would result in mass panic and possibly result in people being killed. So there are some things that we have always been unable to say, because it would harm someone else. Of course if we have tons of money and want to risk going to prison we can go ahead and try yelling fire or try to slander someone. That's kind of how it is with us who write or speak about God's Word. We need to be aware of what the pitfalls of speaking about some things are and take that into consideration.
Believe it or not, I've seen for myself as well as have been told by others who have seen it, that people who read the things we write or listen to what we talk about, will often try the things we mention. For example, that's why we should never mention the name of a false teacher without saying they're a false teacher. Otherwise our readers may run to that persons website thinking they've found another good teacher.
I hope this helps some!  |
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 10, 2020 13:48:31 GMT -5
Yes that was very helpful! Thank you.
I didn't mean to say, Creation Science was actually called a 'conspiracy',
but rather it is often viewed by teachers, scientists etc.
As something...
kind of like a conspiracy.....
In other words, they think it is basically not 'science'
So that would be the 'untrue' part....
and
They see the Creation' aspect
as 'religion'.
I guess I was thinking more along the lines of medicine
like there was a time when washing hands before surgery was
not an issue....
but then at some point the 'germ theory'
became fact
and washing carefully before a surgery became a must due to the fact of germs.
or like
at one time salt was consider fine to eat
then became not good for heart or high blood pressure
so for some people a no salt diet became what was a necessary fact for their health
and
for those at risk,
it became the new truth
( salt was no longer good but bad for them)
and now,
'maybe',
salt is not soooo bad,
or even good or necessary...
even for those that were considered at risk.
Those are not 'true conspiracies'
so it may be more of a 'definition'
problem...
what exactly is a conspiracy?
But what is confusing is how 'science'
will present things as fact today...
later
discover something, that can change the view...
sometimes, to a 180 degree turn about,
what 'was'
true and a fact
However, if any scientific fact is mentioned ahead
of time
( before the time, that would change the direction to no longer true)
or before a consensus of experts agree there is a total change,
in how it is viewed....
changes due to new information
it can be seen as almost like a conspiracy
false
or wrong ( if presented too early)
until....it becomes right to call
what was fact
no longer scientifically factual,
due to,
a consensus based on new information
( unless.....
in yet another 10 years,
some new discovery may change it back to the original thought).
Coffee is another one
that flips back and forth
its good
its bad
its okay in moderation
its poison
its a miracle substance
its okay
But anyway.....LOL
I will be extra careful
about what I write
I didn't think many folks even read this
except and occasional person from FH
and then only occasionally or even
rarely.
although, I have seen surprisingly,
( when clicking to come post
2, 3, or even 4 people viewing)
What?
really?
LOL
So I want to be sure,
anything written to be for God's glory and praise.
However, there does seem to be a big divide
for example on things like:
if wearing masks is the right way to go
or locking down everything
or not allowing people to go to church
Some are adamant,
that such measures are backed by science
and are extremely necessary!!!!
Other doctors and the like
say no
or only for a short time
In any case, I do agree, it really could be preparing people for a one world government
But then,
wouldn't some think that was bordering on a conspiracy?
I actually think it is true
based on what God says will be coming ( Biblical prophecy)
and on what a lot of secular people think would be a great solution to ending wars etc.
( not that it will tho)
But others might think it was a conspiracy
especially....
if based on the Bible
I must be missing something here
probably
Oh well here is part of a definition:
A conspiracy, also known as a plot,
is a secret plan or agreement
between persons for an unlawful
or harmful purpose,
such as murder or treason,
especially with political motivation,
while keeping their agreement secret
from the public or from other people affected by it.
I guess, I think, that must have happened
in the world more than once?
See I am confused arrrggghhh!
So the Illuminati
would be a 'conspiracy'
Some would say there
is not any such people
or group...
others people might totally believe in it.
But correct me if I am wrong
I 'think' you are saying:
It does not really matter
If they are real or not
It is not really something a Christian
ought to be even putting into their
mind....
That would not be something God
would want us to spend or time
thinking about
Right?
And therefore, not something to be writing about
but if such a need came up
to not delve into
and be sure to put a warning about not
getting involved?
Rather to keep our minds stayed on Christ.
|
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 10, 2020 15:00:35 GMT -5
I am kind of stuck today
as what to write?
I have to be careful,
because there is a lot of conflicting
news about covid 19, the pandemic!!!
It is sometimes hard to decide what
is true
and what is conspiracy
In any case, the virus
and fear of it
Plus all manner
of protections, restrictions etc,
Have caused a great divide
among people
and also, there are people still in this category:
26 people fainting with fear
and with foreboding
of what is coming on the world.
For the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
Luke 21:26
Well several news items have been on CNN
about Covid vaccines
Why vaccinate our most frail?
Odd vote out shows the dilemma
[smear:#155d38]"Odd woman out, I guess,
" Dr. Helen "Keipp" Talbot, of Vanderbilt University,
told her colleagues.
"I still struggle with this. This was not an easy vote."
Talbot was worried about whether the vaccine would even work in such frail, vulnerable patients.
Even more, she worried about how it might look
if the vaccine failed in that group,
or how it would affect public perception
if residents died soon after getting the vaccine".[/smear:#d806b1:0]
www.cnn.com/2020/12/04/health/coronavirus-vaccine-acip-nursing-homes-question/index.html?fbclid=IwAR2xCVUd7b4UmvZqJusKFTSB0vLVCvwsvEZp-sX_j0mzULKedZ44F7VzxYk
And going along with that
this too was on CNN
CNN: ‘Don’t Be Alarmed’ if People Start Dying After Taking the Vaccine
[smear:#229125]
“That won’t necessarily have anything to do with the vaccine.”
One of the things we want to make sure people understand is
that they should not be unnecessarily alarmed
if there are reports, once we start vaccinating,
of someone or multiple people dying within a day or two
of their vaccination who are residents of a long-term care facility.
That would be something we would expect,
as a normal occurrence,
because people die frequently in nursing homes.”[/smear:#e61920:0]
summit.news/2020/12/08/cnn-dont-be-alarmed-if-people-start-dying-after-taking-the-vaccine/?fbclid=IwAR3ZFDXVGDsxtRUXDNtBbLmlHpLccxO4doK3-55OjKstFwQ7gD-Mv1sdd4g
I don't know, if that would fall under the umbrella of conspiracy, or not?
To me it sounds true.....
but then, it does beg the question ( to me)
why indeed,
give the vaccine to those who are already extremely frail?
It is of interest to me, because I am heading to age 76 and have a plethora
of medical issues ( Including 2 lung diseases which seem to be getting worse over time).
Nevertheless, we can look at God's Word, the Bible
The Bible is clear
we all will die once
( unless we are raptured)
27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once,
and after that comes judgment,
Hebrews 9:27
and this:
23 For the wages of sin is death,
but the free gift of God is
eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
Plus:
28 And do not fear those who kill the body
but cannot kill the soul.
Rather fear him who can destroy
both soul and body in hell
Matthew 10:28
This great favorite:
Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil,
for you are with me;.....
Psalms 23:4
So on the one hand, there is the
actual medical virus
but on the other hand,
there seems to be
people in power
using it, as a way to gain even more power.
But as for many Christians:
26 For consider your calling, brothers:
not many of you were wise according to worldly standards,
not many were powerful,
not many were of noble birth.
27 But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise;
God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong;
5 so that your faith might not rest in the wisdom of men
but in the power of God.
1 Corinthians 2:5
and ultimately this:
12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood,
but against the rulers,
against the authorities,
against the cosmic powers over this present darkness,
against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.
Ephesians 6:12
Done for today
|
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 10, 2020 17:01:44 GMT -5
I did think of one 'conspiracy' that yesterday,
was at least partially proven true. ( I think?)
Facebook, Twitter, Youtube etc. took down everything having to do with the 'conspiracy' of Hunter Biden and his laptop....
and they continued the censorship for months, before the November election,
including the The New York Post which broke the story.
But yesterday Hunter himself, released a statement saying that the US Attorney in Delaware is investigating him over “tax affairs'.
Well, I think, it might be a conspiracy,
but in my opinion,
I think it is more than just a tax return mistake...
Hunter Biden did have foreign business dealings, with several countries especially China ( so that makes me think, that 'might' come up)
There was also the fact he did land a spot on the board of Burisma, making upwards of $80,000 in US dollars a month,
with seemingly no real experience of what they do, which is oil and gas.
There was a lot more, that was labeled conspiracy, especially before the election and as such,
all was censored or quickly taken down
Like Vice-President Joe Biden was in Kyiv Ukraine,
asking that Shokin be fired,
or Ukraine would not get a billion-dollar loan ....
and so Shokin was in fact, fired and the loan went thru.
And now all those same CEO's ( Facebook, Twitter, You-tube) etc. have vowed
to take down any post
claiming there was any kind of corruption in the voting...
it too is being label false and conspiracy.....
But it seems to me, there really is some evidence
perhaps enough to change who is president elect, even
However, that cannot even be discussed on Facebook, Twitter, or You-tube.
And I am thinking, maybe Christians need to be more focused on the Kingdom of Heaven rather than so much of the endless politics of Today!
But that news about Hunter did come up yesterday.
|
|
|
|
Post by Cindy on Dec 11, 2020 12:07:24 GMT -5
Yes that was very helpful! Thank you.
I didn't mean to say, Creation Science was actually called a 'conspiracy',
but rather it is often viewed by teachers, scientists etc.
As something...
kind of like a conspiracy.....
In other words, they think it is basically not 'science'
So that would be the 'untrue' part....
and
They see the Creation' aspect
as 'religion'.
I guess I was thinking more along the lines of medicine
like there was a time when washing hands before surgery was
not an issue....
but then at some point the 'germ theory'
became fact
and washing carefully before a surgery became a must due to the fact of germs.
or like
at one time salt was consider fine to eat
then became not good for heart or high blood pressure
so for some people a no salt diet became what was a necessary fact for their health
and
for those at risk,
it became the new truth
( salt was no longer good but bad for them)
and now,
'maybe',
salt is not soooo bad,
or even good or necessary...
even for those that were considered at risk.
Those are not 'true conspiracies'
so it may be more of a 'definition'
problem...
what exactly is a conspiracy?
But what is confusing is how 'science'
will present things as fact today...
later
discover something, that can change the view...
sometimes, to a 180 degree turn about,
what 'was'
true and a fact
However, if any scientific fact is mentioned ahead
of time
( before the time, that would change the direction to no longer true)
or before a consensus of experts agree there is a total change,
in how it is viewed....
changes due to new information
it can be seen as almost like a conspiracy
false
or wrong ( if presented too early)
until....it becomes right to call
what was fact
no longer scientifically factual,
due to,
a consensus based on new information
( unless.....
in yet another 10 years,
some new discovery may change it back to the original thought).
Coffee is another one
that flips back and forth
its good
its bad
its okay in moderation
its poison
its a miracle substance
its okay
But anyway.....LOL
I will be extra careful
about what I write
I didn't think many folks even read this
except and occasional person from FH
and then only occasionally or even
rarely.
although, I have seen surprisingly,
( when clicking to come post
2, 3, or even 4 people viewing)
What?
really?
LOL
So I want to be sure,
anything written to be for God's glory and praise.
However, there does seem to be a big divide
for example on things like:
if wearing masks is the right way to go
or locking down everything
or not allowing people to go to church
Some are adamant,
that such measures are backed by science
and are extremely necessary!!!!
Other doctors and the like
say no
or only for a short time
In any case, I do agree, it really could be preparing people for a one world government
But then,
wouldn't some think that was bordering on a conspiracy?
I actually think it is true
based on what God says will be coming ( Biblical prophecy)
and on what a lot of secular people think would be a great solution to ending wars etc.
( not that it will tho)
But others might think it was a conspiracy
especially....
if based on the Bible
I must be missing something here
probably
Oh well here is part of a definition:
A conspiracy, also known as a plot,
is a secret plan or agreement
between persons for an unlawful
or harmful purpose,
such as murder or treason,
especially with political motivation,
while keeping their agreement secret
from the public or from other people affected by it.
I guess, I think, that must have happened
in the world more than once?
See I am confused arrrggghhh!
So the Illuminati
would be a 'conspiracy'
Some would say there
is not any such people
or group...
others people might totally believe in it.
But correct me if I am wrong
I 'think' you are saying:
It does not really matter
If they are real or not
It is not really something a Christian
ought to be even putting into their
mind....
That would not be something God
would want us to spend or time
thinking about
Right?
And therefore, not something to be writing about
but if such a need came up
to not delve into
and be sure to put a warning about not
getting involved?
Rather to keep our minds stayed on Christ.
"A conspiracy, also known as a plot, is a secret plan or agreement between persons for an unlawful or harmful purpose, such as murder or treason, especially with political motivation,
while keeping their agreement secret from the public or from other people affected by it." If you read that again you can see that just believing there's a group like the illuminati by itself doesn't make something a conspiracy theory. Nor is it simply a difference in opinion about something. They have all of the qualifications mentioned in your quote.
I did a search and may have found something that may help you understand... since I can't post enough of it here to help you, I'm sending it in a PM to you.
The only time I can see where it would be appropriate to talk about a conspiracy theory is when you're explaining why they're not true and why they're dangerous.
I am kind of stuck today
as what to write?
I have to be careful,
because there is a lot of conflicting
news about covid 19, the pandemic!!!
It is sometimes hard to decide what
is true
and what is conspiracy
In any case, the virus
and fear of it
Plus all manner
of protections, restrictions etc,
Have caused a great divide
among people
and also, there are people still in this category:
26 people fainting with fear
and with foreboding
of what is coming on the world.
For the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
Luke 21:26
Well several news items have been on CNN
about Covid vaccines
Why vaccinate our most frail?
Odd vote out shows the dilemma
[smear:#155d38]"Odd woman out, I guess,
" Dr. Helen "Keipp" Talbot, of Vanderbilt University,
told her colleagues.
"I still struggle with this. This was not an easy vote."
Talbot was worried about whether the vaccine would even work in such frail, vulnerable patients.
Even more, she worried about how it might look
if the vaccine failed in that group,
or how it would affect public perception
if residents died soon after getting the vaccine".[/smear:#d806b1:0]
www.cnn.com/2020/12/04/health/coronavirus-vaccine-acip-nursing-homes-question/index.html?fbclid=IwAR2xCVUd7b4UmvZqJusKFTSB0vLVCvwsvEZp-sX_j0mzULKedZ44F7VzxYk
And going along with that
this too was on CNN
CNN: ‘Don’t Be Alarmed’ if People Start Dying After Taking the Vaccine
[smear:#229125]
“That won’t necessarily have anything to do with the vaccine.”
One of the things we want to make sure people understand is
that they should not be unnecessarily alarmed
if there are reports, once we start vaccinating,
of someone or multiple people dying within a day or two
of their vaccination who are residents of a long-term care facility.
That would be something we would expect,
as a normal occurrence,
because people die frequently in nursing homes.”[/smear:#e61920:0]
summit.news/2020/12/08/cnn-dont-be-alarmed-if-people-start-dying-after-taking-the-vaccine/?fbclid=IwAR3ZFDXVGDsxtRUXDNtBbLmlHpLccxO4doK3-55OjKstFwQ7gD-Mv1sdd4g
I don't know, if that would fall under the umbrella of conspiracy, or not?
To me it sounds true.....
but then, it does beg the question ( to me)
why indeed,
give the vaccine to those who are already extremely frail?
It is of interest to me, because I am heading to age 76 and have a plethora
of medical issues ( Including 2 lung diseases which seem to be getting worse over time).
Nevertheless, we can look at God's Word, the Bible
The Bible is clear
we all will die once
( unless we are raptured)
27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once,
and after that comes judgment,
Hebrews 9:27
and this:
23 For the wages of sin is death,
but the free gift of God is
eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
Plus:
28 And do not fear those who kill the body
but cannot kill the soul.
Rather fear him who can destroy
both soul and body in hell
Matthew 10:28
This great favorite:
Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil,
for you are with me;.....
Psalms 23:4
So on the one hand, there is the
actual medical virus
but on the other hand,
there seems to be
people in power
using it, as a way to gain even more power.
But as for many Christians:
26 For consider your calling, brothers:
not many of you were wise according to worldly standards,
not many were powerful,
not many were of noble birth.
27 But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise;
God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong;
5 so that your faith might not rest in the wisdom of men
but in the power of God.
1 Corinthians 2:5
and ultimately this:
12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood,
but against the rulers,
against the authorities,
against the cosmic powers over this present darkness,
against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.
Ephesians 6:12
Done for today
Well, we could do a study about 1 Peter 4:17–19, since they can tie into what we've been talking about. But if we do, we should do it on the other thread, the one entitled, "What's the Pandemic all about". “For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God? And, “If it is hard for the righteous to be saved, what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?” So then, those who suffer according to God’s will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good.” (1 Peter 4:17–19)
Another option we could discuss on "what's the pandemic all about" could be hoarding. Is it right to store up a bunch of food or supplies in case you'll need them? (like many "preppers" do) You could start with this scripture (or any other you want to use) and go from there: Amos 3:10 —“They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord, “who hoard plunder and loot in their fortresses.” * Or maybe Genesis 41:49. Also to be put on "What's the Pandemic all about".
Another possibility is Nahum 2:1–13. When God judged the Assyrians, they could understand, if they chose to, why he did it the way he did. Can you see God adopting the same approach today by operating in ways that people can understand? Can you think of any examples? We could also talk about how people tend to ignore God until there's a disaster and then they start asking how a God of love could allow such a thing. etc. Also to be put on "What's the Pandemic all about".
Or we could discuss all or portions of Philippians 3:2- 21
“Their destiny is destruction, their god is their stomach, and their glory is in their shame. Their mind is on earthly things.” (Philippians 3:19)
and Isaiah 3:9-12.
“The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves. Tell the righteous it will be well with them, for they will enjoy the fruit of their deeds. Woe to the wicked! Disaster is upon them! They will be paid back for what their hands have done. Youths oppress my people, women rule over them. O my people, your guides lead you astray; they turn you from the path.” (Isaiah 3:9–12)
Or something else entirely! Whatever you'd like to do.
Also when I did a search for what is a conspiracy theory this turned up:
The coronavirus pandemic 'Great Reset' theory and a false vaccine claim debunked
You might want to read that.
As for the rest of your questions about conspiracy I'll wait till you've read what I sent you in a PM as well as the one above.
I'm hoping we can get back on track here soon and discuss the things we talked about.
I did think of one 'conspiracy' that yesterday,
was at least partially proven true. ( I think?)
Facebook, Twitter, Youtube etc. took down everything having to do with the 'conspiracy' of Hunter Biden and his laptop....
and they continued the censorship for months, before the November election,
including the The New York Post which broke the story.
But yesterday Hunter himself, released a statement saying that the US Attorney in Delaware is investigating him over “tax affairs'.
Well, I think, it might be a conspiracy,
but in my opinion,
I think it is more than just a tax return mistake...
Hunter Biden did have foreign business dealings, with several countries especially China ( so that makes me think, that 'might' come up)
There was also the fact he did land a spot on the board of Burisma, making upwards of $80,000 in US dollars a month,
with seemingly no real experience of what they do, which is oil and gas.
There was a lot more, that was labeled conspiracy, especially before the election and as such,
all was censored or quickly taken down
Like Vice-President Joe Biden was in Kyiv Ukraine,
asking that Shokin be fired,
or Ukraine would not get a billion-dollar loan ....
and so Shokin was in fact, fired and the loan went thru.
And now all those same CEO's ( Facebook, Twitter, You-tube) etc. have vowed
to take down any post
claiming there was any kind of corruption in the voting...
it too is being label false and conspiracy.....
But it seems to me, there really is some evidence
perhaps enough to change who is president elect, even
However, that cannot even be discussed on Facebook, Twitter, or You-tube.
And I am thinking, maybe Christians need to be more focused on the Kingdom of Heaven rather than so much of the endless politics of Today!
But that news about Hunter did come up yesterday.
I'm done with conspiracies for now, at least till you've read what I sent you. |
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 11, 2020 12:39:41 GMT -5
I read both articles and think, I am slowly getting a clearer picture of the difference between what is a conspiracy ( which may be true) and a conspiracy theory ( which cannot be proven and is most likely not true).
Thanks, soooooo now will try to get back on track.
Thank you for posting the original direction we should be looking at.
|
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 11, 2020 13:17:35 GMT -5
“For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God;
and if it begins with us,
what will the outcome be
for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
And, “If it is hard for the righteous to be saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”
So then, those who suffer according to God’s will
should commit themselves to their faithful Creator
and continue to do good.”
1 Peter 4:17-19
I think we can say, there is a time for
judgment to begin.
And this pandemic may be at least,
a partial judgment for America
but the whole world
that has turned it's back on God
in a massive way.
But verse 17 says it will begin with the house of God.
If we go back to verse 12 of 1 Peter
God says:
12 Beloved, do not be surprised
at the fiery trial
when it comes upon you to test you,
as though something strange were happening to you.
1 Peter 4:12
I realize the first thing is,
we should not be surprised,
at a pandemic, or violence, wars, etc.
These things are inevitable in a fallen world.
However, it is also to test the believer.
So God will use this pandemic for His purpose.
Not only that, but there will be suffering
and how will we react as Christians to suffering?
I think there ought to be a difference
as to how Christians react to this virus
and how unbelievers do.
I know many people are in great fear
of dying,
and in panic
that they also won't have enough
food etc.
as a result of
not being able to work etc.
For Christians we may need to keep
this verse always in mind:
fear not, for I am with you;
be not dismayed, for I am your God;
I will strengthen you, I will help you,
I will uphold you with my righteous right hand.
Isaiah 41:10
And in the midst of
chaos
worry
anger
fear etc,
This would also be a good verse to remember:
11 and to aspire to live quietly,
and to mind your own affairs,
and to work with your hands, as we instructed you,
1 Thessalonians 4:11
We can do this,
knowing Jesus is with us.
I suppose this could
even refer to
not getting
involved
in political agitation,
or revolution etc
which is not generally
peaceful.
Jesus did not violently protest
the unfair government of His day.
So we can expect to suffer as Christians
can we find joy and peace in that?
If we are being agitators and rebel- rousers
If we are I don't think
we are being good ambassadors for Christ,
and probably will not find joy or peace,
in our suffering.
And if the virus is a sign that the End is near
We need all the more to:
15 Look carefully then how you walk,
not as unwise but as wise,
Ephesians 5:15
Here is an interesting verse
that may have meaning to this topic:
6 Kill old men outright,
young men and maidens,
little children and women,
but touch no one on whom is the mark.
And begin at my sanctuary.”
So they began with the elders who were before the house.
Ezekiel 9:6
I believer the mark would be from God
not the 'other mark'.
And so it is better we suffer
a little now,
than for ever.
and we can consider this also:
19 And my God
will supply every need of yours
according to his riches
in glory
in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 4:19
Maybe that should be a verse for those who think they should hoard?
Done for Today
|
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 12, 2020 12:33:34 GMT -5
So onto the Pandemic and hoarding.
As you wrote:
"Another option we could discuss on
"what's the pandemic all about"
could be hoarding.
Is it right to store up a bunch of food or supplies in case you'll need them?
(like many "preppers" do)
You could start with this scripture
(or any other you want to use) and go from there:
Amos 3:10 —“They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“who hoard plunder and loot in their fortresses.” *
Or maybe Genesis 41:49. "
Certainly, at the beginning of the 'pandemic'
there was a big rush to hoard
and tho this is a serious subject.
It was kind of funny
that a major item for hoarding
was toilet paper....
To be truthful, I too was tempted to hoard
TP also.....
not too many substitutes
( maybe cut up rags?...ugh!)
But beyond the hoarding for themselves,
some folks,
even
saw it as a way
to get rich quick.
By buying up every item
( Like TP)
for hundreds of miles around...
and then, list it online
for a 20% or more markup!
There are several instances in scripture
about storing up food etc.
One that comes to mind is,
concerning Joseph and Pharaoh king of Egypt
and the coming 7 year famine in Egypt.
So it's true, that the solution
Joseph proposed was to collect
(store up, hoard)
grain during the 7 prosperous years:
34 ..............take one-fifth of the produce
of the land of Egypt during the seven plentiful years.
35 And let them gather all the food of these good years that are coming
and store up grain under the authority of Pharaoh
for food in the cities, and let them keep it.
36 That food shall be a reserve
for the land against the seven years of famine
that are to occur in the land of Egypt,
so that the land may not perish through the famine.”
Genesis 41:34-26
49 And Joseph stored up grain in great abundance,
like the sand of the sea,
until he ceased to measure it,
for it could not be measured.
Genesis 41:49
Although it did save the lives
of many Egyptians,
it was not without a cost!
First the Egyptians lost their money to Pharaoh
then all their herds, livestock etc.
17 So they brought their livestock to Joseph,
and Joseph gave them food
in exchange for the horses, the flocks, the herds, and the donkeys.
He supplied them with food in exchange for all their livestock that year.
Genesis 47:17
and then, their land
and finally they became servants ( maybe even slaves)
“......We will not hide from my lord that our money is all spent.
The herds of livestock are my lord's.
There is nothing left in the sight of my lord
but our bodies and our land.
Genesis 47:18
I am thinking, the problem here was
looking to the government (Pharaoh)
to be the only solution....
Did they pray to God?
When Joseph's family came
they did not have to give any of that
they did not sell their land...
rather,
they were given land!
6 The land of Egypt is before you.
Settle your father and your brothers
in the best of the land.
Let them settle in the land of Goshen,
Genesis 47:6
They hoarded nothing
they had nothing
except....
they had God
and he provided for them.
Another example in Scripture
was told by Jesus:
16 And he told them a parable, saying,
“The land of a rich man produced plentifully,
17 and he thought to himself,
‘What shall I do, for I have nowhere to store my crops?’
18 And he said, ‘I will do this:
I will tear down my barns and build larger ones,
and there I will store all my grain and my goods.
19 And I will say to my soul,
“Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years;
relax, eat, drink, be merry.”’
20 But God said to him,
‘Fool!
This night your soul is required of you,
and the things you have prepared,
whose will they be?’
21 So is the one who lays up treasure for himself
and is not rich toward God.”
Luke 12:16-21
I don't think, storing a bit of extra food
in case of a storm etc.
is a sin...
But it is when we determine to
rely on ourselves ONLY,
So that we do not allow even
the possibility of God intervening,
like He did for Joseph and his family
then I think we are sinning.
And this becomes true:
They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“who hoard plunder
and loot
in their fortresses.”
Amos 3:10
There is no trusting or looking to God
when we rely ONLY on ourselves
God says this:
26 Look at the birds of the air:
they neither sow
nor reap
nor gather into barns,
and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.
Are you not of more value than they?
Matthew 6:26
This is not to say, we should do nothing
make no provisions for a coming crisis....
and presume on the Lord
to provide
everything
all the time
while we do nothing..
We are to keep our priorities straight:
33 But seek first the kingdom of God
and his righteousness,
and all these things will be added to you.
Matthew 6:33
Hoarding is often a sign of fear
and lack of trust in God.
There is also hoarding
that is hurting others
while enriching only yourself.
I think preparing and having extra for your family
and others, is not necessarily a sin
and might be very practical.
It's our heart attitude
and our trust in God
we need to look at.
God 'could' provide for us
like the manna for the Jews
or
how He provided for Elijah:
1 Now Elijah the Tishbite, of Tishbe in Gilead,
said to Ahab,
“As the Lord, the God of Israel, lives,
before whom I stand,
there shall be neither dew nor rain these years,
except by my word.”
2 And the word of the Lord came to him:
3 “Depart from here
and turn eastward
and hide yourself by the brook Cherith,
which is east of the Jordan.
4 You shall drink from the brook,
and I have commanded the ravens to feed you there.”
1 Kings 17:1-4
Jesus when sending out His disciples
on one occasion told them to bring nothing,
and on another occasion,
to provide for themselves.
His disciples looked to Jesus for direction
on if the should provide or not.
5 If any of you lacks wisdom,
let him ask God,
who gives generously to all without reproach,
and it will be given him.
James 1:5
Done for Today
|
|
fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 13, 2020 10:05:20 GMT -5
Last night, just as I was falling asleep
I remembered one time God
told us to actually 'store up' ( hoard, if you will)
treasures!!!!
Well.........
Actually,
it was kind of both......
God said:
Don't store up...
and
Store up!
19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth,
where moth and rust destroy
and where thieves break in and steal,
20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven,
where neither moth nor rust destroys
and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Matthew 6:19-21
That is not to say,
we cannot have a bank account
or extra food for a coming storm
or a collection of books
art, photos, etc.
But when they become and end all
otherwise know as 'idols',
they are a trouble and a sin!
They are not nearly the value
of what is in Heaven!
We need to remember this verse:
24 “No one can serve two masters,
for either he will hate the one
and love the other,
or he will be devoted to the one
and despise the other.
You cannot serve God
and money
Matthew 6:24
The question is what are the 'treasures'
we 'can store'
in Heaven
I think one way is
to share what we have
with those in need:
38 give,
and it will be given to you.
Good measure,
pressed down,
shaken together,
running over,
will be put into your lap.
For with the measure you use it
will be measured back to you.”
Luke 6:38
Ha ha, that verse is kind of
counterproductive
We give,
and end up with much more!
OH!
Well, it may be that God
wants us to give even more,
In order to show His love
and care.
35 In all things I have shown you
that by working hard in this way
we must help the weak
and remember the words of the Lord Jesus,
how he himself said,
‘It is more blessed to give
than to receive.’”
Acts 20:35
It is also important
how we give,
not because
we HAVE to,
and in a begrudging way,
Rather:
7 Each one must give as he has decided in his heart,
not reluctantly
or under compulsion,
for God loves a cheerful giver.
2 Corinthians 9:7
We so often live as if this life is it!
When we die, we are dead,
and
that....... is that!
But that is NOT the truth!!!
1 If then you have been raised with Christ,
seek the things that are above,
where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
2 Set your minds on things that are above,
not on things that are on earth.
3 For you have died,
and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
4 When Christ who is your life appears,
then you also will appear with him in glory.
Colossians 3:1-4
On thing we can store up ( hoard :)
on earth,
that I am pretty sure
will be stored in Heaven is:
My son, keep my words
and treasure up my commandments with you;
Proverbs 7:1
We need to be reading the Bible
and memorizing it.
And there is this ,to store up:
17 As for the rich in this present age,
charge them not to be haughty,
nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches,
but on God,
who richly provides us with everything to enjoy.
18 They are to do good,
to be rich in good works,
to be generous and ready to share,
19 thus storing up treasure for themselves
as a good foundation for the future,
so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
1 Timothy 6:17-19
And Jesus said this:
41 The one who receives a prophet
because he is a prophet
will receive a prophet's reward,
and the one who receives a righteous person
because he is a righteous person
will receive a righteous person's reward.
42 And whoever gives one of these little ones
even a cup of cold water
because he is a disciple,
truly, I say to you,
he will by no means lose his reward.”
Matthew 10:41,42
The words: will receive suggest to me
that would be in the future
in Heaven.
23 Whatever you do,
work heartily,
as for the Lord
and not for men,
24 knowing that from the Lord
you will receive the inheritance
as your reward.
You are serving the Lord Christ.
Colossians 3
And the troubles of the pandemic
chaos, worries etc.
of this life?
18 For I consider that the sufferings
of this present time
are not worth
comparing with the glory
that is to be revealed to us.
Romans 8:18
So finally for Today these verses:
56 The sting of death is sin,
and the power of sin
is the law.
57 But thanks be to God,
who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
58 Therefore, my beloved brothers,
be steadfast,
immovable,
always abounding in the work of the Lord,
knowing that in the Lord
your labor is not in vain.
1 Corinthians 15:56-58
Sometimes, it might seem
all is in vain
in this life,
but that is not the truth.....
We can store up love, compassion, and care for others
and
Praise, worship, God's word in our hearts and mind,
love and obedience to God.
These things are of true value...
material items.....
not so much!
Done for Today
|
|
|
|
Post by Cindy on Dec 14, 2020 11:38:38 GMT -5
“For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God;
and if it begins with us,
what will the outcome be
for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
And, “If it is hard for the righteous to be saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”
So then, those who suffer according to God’s will
should commit themselves to their faithful Creator
and continue to do good.”
1 Peter 4:17-19
I think we can say, there is a time for
judgment to begin.
And this pandemic may be at least,
a partial judgment for America
but the whole world
that has turned it's back on God
in a massive way.
But verse 17 says it will begin with the house of God.
If we go back to verse 12 of 1 Peter
God says:
12 Beloved, do not be surprised
at the fiery trial
when it comes upon you to test you,
as though something strange were happening to you.
1 Peter 4:12
I realize the first thing is,
we should not be surprised,
at a pandemic, or violence, wars, etc.
These things are inevitable in a fallen world.
However, it is also to test the believer.
So God will use this pandemic for His purpose.
Not only that, but there will be suffering
and how will we react as Christians to suffering?
I think there ought to be a difference
as to how Christians react to this virus
and how unbelievers do.
I know many people are in great fear
of dying,
and in panic
that they also won't have enough
food etc.
as a result of
not being able to work etc.
For Christians we may need to keep
this verse always in mind:
fear not, for I am with you;
be not dismayed, for I am your God;
I will strengthen you, I will help you,
I will uphold you with my righteous right hand.
Isaiah 41:10
And in the midst of
chaos
worry
anger
fear etc,
This would also be a good verse to remember:
11 and to aspire to live quietly,
and to mind your own affairs,
and to work with your hands, as we instructed you,
1 Thessalonians 4:11
We can do this,
knowing Jesus is with us.
I suppose this could
even refer to
not getting
involved
in political agitation,
or revolution etc
which is not generally
peaceful.
Jesus did not violently protest
the unfair government of His day.
So we can expect to suffer as Christians
can we find joy and peace in that?
If we are being agitators and rebel- rousers
If we are I don't think
we are being good ambassadors for Christ,
and probably will not find joy or peace,
in our suffering.
And if the virus is a sign that the End is near
We need all the more to:
15 Look carefully then how you walk,
not as unwise but as wise,
Ephesians 5:15
Here is an interesting verse
that may have meaning to this topic:
6 Kill old men outright,
young men and maidens,
little children and women,
but touch no one on whom is the mark.
And begin at my sanctuary.”
So they began with the elders who were before the house.
Ezekiel 9:6
I believer the mark would be from God
not the 'other mark'.
And so it is better we suffer
a little now,
than for ever.
and we can consider this also:
19 And my God
will supply every need of yours
according to his riches
in glory
in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 4:19
Maybe that should be a verse for those who think they should hoard?
Done for Today
So onto the Pandemic and hoarding.
As you wrote:
"Another option we could discuss on
"what's the pandemic all about"
could be hoarding.
Is it right to store up a bunch of food or supplies in case you'll need them?
(like many "preppers" do)
You could start with this scripture
(or any other you want to use) and go from there:
Amos 3:10 —“They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“who hoard plunder and loot in their fortresses.” *
Or maybe Genesis 41:49. "
Certainly, at the beginning of the 'pandemic'
there was a big rush to hoard
and tho this is a serious subject.
It was kind of funny
that a major item for hoarding
was toilet paper....
To be truthful, I too was tempted to hoard
TP also.....
not too many substitutes
( maybe cut up rags?...ugh!)
But beyond the hoarding for themselves,
some folks,
even
saw it as a way
to get rich quick.
By buying up every item
( Like TP)
for hundreds of miles around...
and then, list it online
for a 20% or more markup!
There are several instances in scripture
about storing up food etc.
One that comes to mind is,
concerning Joseph and Pharaoh king of Egypt
and the coming 7 year famine in Egypt.
So it's true, that the solution
Joseph proposed was to collect
(store up, hoard)
grain during the 7 prosperous years:
34 ..............take one-fifth of the produce
of the land of Egypt during the seven plentiful years.
35 And let them gather all the food of these good years that are coming
and store up grain under the authority of Pharaoh
for food in the cities, and let them keep it.
36 That food shall be a reserve
for the land against the seven years of famine
that are to occur in the land of Egypt,
so that the land may not perish through the famine.”
Genesis 41:34-26
49 And Joseph stored up grain in great abundance,
like the sand of the sea,
until he ceased to measure it,
for it could not be measured.
Genesis 41:49
Although it did save the lives
of many Egyptians,
it was not without a cost!
First the Egyptians lost their money to Pharaoh
then all their herds, livestock etc.
17 So they brought their livestock to Joseph,
and Joseph gave them food
in exchange for the horses, the flocks, the herds, and the donkeys.
He supplied them with food in exchange for all their livestock that year.
Genesis 47:17
and then, their land
and finally they became servants ( maybe even slaves)
“......We will not hide from my lord that our money is all spent.
The herds of livestock are my lord's.
There is nothing left in the sight of my lord
but our bodies and our land.
Genesis 47:18
I am thinking, the problem here was
looking to the government (Pharaoh)
to be the only solution....
Did they pray to God?
When Joseph's family came
they did not have to give any of that
they did not sell their land...
rather,
they were given land!
6 The land of Egypt is before you.
Settle your father and your brothers
in the best of the land.
Let them settle in the land of Goshen,
Genesis 47:6
They hoarded nothing
they had nothing
except....
they had God
and he provided for them.
Another example in Scripture
was told by Jesus:
16 And he told them a parable, saying,
“The land of a rich man produced plentifully,
17 and he thought to himself,
‘What shall I do, for I have nowhere to store my crops?’
18 And he said, ‘I will do this:
I will tear down my barns and build larger ones,
and there I will store all my grain and my goods.
19 And I will say to my soul,
“Soul, you have ample goods laid up for many years;
relax, eat, drink, be merry.”’
20 But God said to him,
‘Fool!
This night your soul is required of you,
and the things you have prepared,
whose will they be?’
21 So is the one who lays up treasure for himself
and is not rich toward God.”
Luke 12:16-21
I don't think, storing a bit of extra food
in case of a storm etc.
is a sin...
But it is when we determine to
rely on ourselves ONLY,
So that we do not allow even
the possibility of God intervening,
like He did for Joseph and his family
then I think we are sinning.
And this becomes true:
They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“who hoard plunder
and loot
in their fortresses.”
Amos 3:10
There is no trusting or looking to God
when we rely ONLY on ourselves
God says this:
26 Look at the birds of the air:
they neither sow
nor reap
nor gather into barns,
and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.
Are you not of more value than they?
Matthew 6:26
This is not to say, we should do nothing
make no provisions for a coming crisis....
and presume on the Lord
to provide
everything
all the time
while we do nothing..
We are to keep our priorities straight:
33 But seek first the kingdom of God
and his righteousness,
and all these things will be added to you.
Matthew 6:33
Hoarding is often a sign of fear
and lack of trust in God.
There is also hoarding
that is hurting others
while enriching only yourself.
I think preparing and having extra for your family
and others, is not necessarily a sin
and might be very practical.
It's our heart attitude
and our trust in God
we need to look at.
God 'could' provide for us
like the manna for the Jews
or
how He provided for Elijah:
1 Now Elijah the Tishbite, of Tishbe in Gilead,
said to Ahab,
“As the Lord, the God of Israel, lives,
before whom I stand,
there shall be neither dew nor rain these years,
except by my word.”
2 And the word of the Lord came to him:
3 “Depart from here
and turn eastward
and hide yourself by the brook Cherith,
which is east of the Jordan.
4 You shall drink from the brook,
and I have commanded the ravens to feed you there.”
1 Kings 17:1-4
Jesus when sending out His disciples
on one occasion told them to bring nothing,
and on another occasion,
to provide for themselves.
His disciples looked to Jesus for direction
on if the should provide or not.
5 If any of you lacks wisdom,
let him ask God,
who gives generously to all without reproach,
and it will be given him.
James 1:5
Done for Today
Last night, just as I was falling asleep
I remembered one time God
told us to actually 'store up' ( hoard, if you will)
treasures!!!!
Well.........
Actually,
it was kind of both......
God said:
Don't store up...
and
Store up!
19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth,
where moth and rust destroy
and where thieves break in and steal,
20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven,
where neither moth nor rust destroys
and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Matthew 6:19-21
That is not to say,
we cannot have a bank account
or extra food for a coming storm
or a collection of books
art, photos, etc.
But when they become and end all
otherwise know as 'idols',
they are a trouble and a sin!
They are not nearly the value
of what is in Heaven!
We need to remember this verse:
24 “No one can serve two masters,
for either he will hate the one
and love the other,
or he will be devoted to the one
and despise the other.
You cannot serve God
and money
Matthew 6:24
The question is what are the 'treasures'
we 'can store'
in Heaven
I think one way is
to share what we have
with those in need:
38 give,
and it will be given to you.
Good measure,
pressed down,
shaken together,
running over,
will be put into your lap.
For with the measure you use it
will be measured back to you.”
Luke 6:38
Ha ha, that verse is kind of
counterproductive
We give,
and end up with much more!
OH!
Well, it may be that God
wants us to give even more,
In order to show His love
and care.
35 In all things I have shown you
that by working hard in this way
we must help the weak
and remember the words of the Lord Jesus,
how he himself said,
‘It is more blessed to give
than to receive.’”
Acts 20:35
It is also important
how we give,
not because
we HAVE to,
and in a begrudging way,
Rather:
7 Each one must give as he has decided in his heart,
not reluctantly
or under compulsion,
for God loves a cheerful giver.
2 Corinthians 9:7
We so often live as if this life is it!
When we die, we are dead,
and
that....... is that!
But that is NOT the truth!!!
1 If then you have been raised with Christ,
seek the things that are above,
where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
2 Set your minds on things that are above,
not on things that are on earth.
3 For you have died,
and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
4 When Christ who is your life appears,
then you also will appear with him in glory.
Colossians 3:1-4
On thing we can store up ( hoard :)
on earth,
that I am pretty sure
will be stored in Heaven is:
My son, keep my words
and treasure up my commandments with you;
Proverbs 7:1
We need to be reading the Bible
and memorizing it.
And there is this ,to store up:
17 As for the rich in this present age,
charge them not to be haughty,
nor to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches,
but on God,
who richly provides us with everything to enjoy.
18 They are to do good,
to be rich in good works,
to be generous and ready to share,
19 thus storing up treasure for themselves
as a good foundation for the future,
so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
1 Timothy 6:17-19
And Jesus said this:
41 The one who receives a prophet
because he is a prophet
will receive a prophet's reward,
and the one who receives a righteous person
because he is a righteous person
will receive a righteous person's reward.
42 And whoever gives one of these little ones
even a cup of cold water
because he is a disciple,
truly, I say to you,
he will by no means lose his reward.”
Matthew 10:41,42
The words: will receive suggest to me
that would be in the future
in Heaven.
23 Whatever you do,
work heartily,
as for the Lord
and not for men,
24 knowing that from the Lord
you will receive the inheritance
as your reward.
You are serving the Lord Christ.
Colossians 3
And the troubles of the pandemic
chaos, worries etc.
of this life?
18 For I consider that the sufferings
of this present time
are not worth
comparing with the glory
that is to be revealed to us.
Romans 8:18
So finally for Today these verses:
56 The sting of death is sin,
and the power of sin
is the law.
57 But thanks be to God,
who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
58 Therefore, my beloved brothers,
be steadfast,
immovable,
always abounding in the work of the Lord,
knowing that in the Lord
your labor is not in vain.
1 Corinthians 15:56-58
Sometimes, it might seem
all is in vain
in this life,
but that is not the truth.....
We can store up love, compassion, and care for others
and
Praise, worship, God's word in our hearts and mind,
love and obedience to God.
These things are of true value...
material items.....
not so much!
Done for Today
? If so what do you see it as?
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 14, 2020 12:44:31 GMT -5
I will take a stab at your last question......
but I am sure you know by now...
I ummmm
often,
sometimes,
frequently,
occasionally....
Totally miss your point or what you were getting at
and go off, in an entirely different tangent! sigh
Soooooo
oh well be kind if I don't have a clue LOL
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 14, 2020 14:56:32 GMT -5
So you posed the question:
"Could there be a link between 1 Peter 4:17–19, and Amos 3:10"
Oy Vey!
So don't be frustrated if I totally miss the point
You can just tell me the way to go LOL
So First Peter 4:17-19
17 For it is time for judgment to begin
at the household of God;
and if it begins with us,
what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
18 And “If the righteous is scarcely saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”
19 Therefore let those who suffer according to God's will
entrust their souls to a faithful Creator while doing good.
1 Peter 4:17–19
and the Amos verse:
“They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“those who store up violence and robbery in their strongholds.”
Amos 3:10
It seems like, Christians have always had to 'suffer'
and now, as we move...
more and more into the End Times,
it seems like judgment will begin at the household of God
and we must suffer.
We have been talking about 'storing up or hoarding'.
Could it be that is some way the Amos verse
applies to Christians somehow?
And so, as a result,
judgment is coming...
and will begin,
starting at the household of God
( with Christians).
I am thinking a question might be
what have Christians been storing up
that would be considered violence and robbery?
Perhaps, one way Christians can be accused of
robbery is robbery against God,
is in several ways:
8 Will man rob God?
Yet you are robbing me.
But you say, ‘How have we robbed you?’ In your tithes and contributions.
Malachi 3:8
Some Christians will say:
Oh not so, I always give
to the church Sundays:
I put in my dollar,
or ten dollars
or
twenty
or even fifty!!!
And how much have we been
'storing up' for ourselves:
For a new car
a boat
a new and bigger house
a really 'good' gaming computer
( a really really good one is close to $5,000)
etc etc. etc.
Another way we may rob God,
is to not give Him to honor, praise, worship, love etc.
He so deserves!!!
When we put a 'super bowl game'
( or any other event,
concert, entertainment, etc.
as a first priority
or a camping trip,
or sleeping in
etc.
and have little interest in going to church.
Plus, Christians have been compromising
in so many sins like :
sexual sins,
having other interests, as priority,
such as making lots of money
loving the world
etc.
Instead of reading, and studying God's Word, the Bible,
fellowshiping with other believers,
and in our relationship with Jesus...
not even having time to pray, being unaware:
7 The end of all things is at hand;
therefore be self-controlled
and sober-minded
for the sake of your prayers.
1 Peter 4:7
We also rob God, when we don't spread the gospel in anyway.
When we put other issues ahead of God like:
politics,
the environment,
save the whales ( or whatever)
social justice
etc.
Also when we don't obey God's Word
when we
store up excuses for ourselves,
and make exceptions as to
why we need to let some sins slide.
So we need to think about this verse:
32 But when we are judged by the Lord,
we are disciplined
so that we may not be condemned along with the world.
1 Corinthians 11:32
Being judged or disciplined are not words
people like.....
especially not in today's world
nor by many Christians!
Still, the purpose of God's
discipline
is first:
Justified
and
Second
Is for our benefit!!!
Lest, I am misunderstood
this is not an appeal, saying we must
work harder, give more etc.
it is first and foremost
a heart issue
If we gave all our money to the church
begudingly and spent all our time reading God's word but hating every minute
3 If I give away all I have,
and if I deliver up my body to be burned,
but have not love, I gain nothing.
1 Corinthians 13:3
We have most of all robbed God of love
and thus do not know, how to do right.
Done for today.
[/font comic sans MS][/font][/b]
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Post by Cindy on Dec 15, 2020 12:16:34 GMT -5
I will take a stab at your last question......
but I am sure you know by now...
I ummmm
often,
sometimes,
frequently,
occasionally....
Totally miss your point or what you were getting at
and go off, in an entirely different tangent! sigh
Soooooo
oh well be kind if I don't have a clue LOL
I believe there is a difference between the two, or at least there can be. You even started to say something about the difference in your post. Storing up would be getting some extra things at the market because a storm is coming, or because you realize that there are times you're too sick to go shopping so you like to keep enough so that if you have to skip a week you won't go hungry. But, if you discover that a friend or even someone you don't know well is hurting financially and needs food, you would take everything you can possibly spare (and probably some things you can't spare!) and give it to them. Or if they only had a small need, you would of course fill that. But you certainly would just say, "Oh that's too bad, I'm sorry to hear that!" That to me is what "storing up" is about. It's not about keeping the "extra" forever "just in case", but about filling a need. When we "store up" something we don't tend to hang on to it as though our life depended on it. Instead we hold it loosely, willing to give it to others if they need it.
Hoarding something on the other hand is quite different. Hoarding is what some folks did recently with toilet paper (of all things!) When you hoard something, you don't give it up to anyone for any reason. There are many people in the US that call themselves "preppers" and they hoard food like crazy. They attempt to have several years worth stored up and they will kill rather then give it away. Then there are Mormons who are told them must have a years worth of food stored up in their home. Some of them are so afraid of not having enough that they hoard that food, while others simply store it up and are willing to give it away to someone in need.
We really can't use what Joseph did as an example for what we should do individually, because he wasn't doing it for himself, but for quite a few nations. (Genesis 41:57) Joseph did not make himself or the Pharaoh rich at the expense of the people of Egypt and the other nations. The Pharaoh was already wealthy, so the famine didn't really hurt him much at all. But even the other people who were very wealthy were eventually harmed because it was either die of starvation or become share croppers (in a sense) in order to eat. By the end of the famine there were no rich, middle class and poor, there were just the poor. But they all loved Joseph because he had kept them all alive and didn't use what was happening to make himself rich. What I'm trying to say and doing so badly, is that Joseph didn't make them sell their livestock, and then their land, and eventually make themselves slaves to hurt them. He did it to keep them alive. It's really amazing that Egypt, all by itself, was able to feed not only all it's people but also all the people of all the other countries! Obviously that was a God thing! But we most certainly shouldn't attempt to force people to sell their belongings etc to get what we've stored up (or hoarded!). That's what I meant by us not being able to use Joseph as an example of what we should do.
So you posed the question:
"Could there be a link between 1 Peter 4:17–19, and Amos 3:10"
Oy Vey!
So don't be frustrated if I totally miss the point
You can just tell me the way to go LOL
So First Peter 4:17-19
17 For it is time for judgment to begin
at the household of God;
and if it begins with us,
what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?
18 And “If the righteous is scarcely saved,
what will become of the ungodly and the sinner?”
19 Therefore let those who suffer according to God's will
entrust their souls to a faithful Creator while doing good.
1 Peter 4:17–19
and the Amos verse:
“They do not know how to do right,” declares the Lord,
“those who store up violence and robbery in their strongholds.”
Amos 3:10
It seems like, Christians have always had to 'suffer'
and now, as we move...
more and more into the End Times,
it seems like judgment will begin at the household of God
and we must suffer.
We have been talking about 'storing up or hoarding'.
Could it be that is some way the Amos verse
applies to Christians somehow?
And so, as a result,
judgment is coming...
and will begin,
starting at the household of God
( with Christians).
I am thinking a question might be
what have Christians been storing up
that would be considered violence and robbery?
Perhaps, one way Christians can be accused of
robbery is robbery against God,
is in several ways:
8 Will man rob God?
Yet you are robbing me.
But you say, ‘How have we robbed you?’ In your tithes and contributions.
Malachi 3:8
Some Christians will say:
Oh not so, I always give
to the church Sundays:
I put in my dollar,
or ten dollars
or
twenty
or even fifty!!!
And how much have we been
'storing up' for ourselves:
For a new car
a boat
a new and bigger house
a really 'good' gaming computer
( a really really good one is close to $5,000)
etc etc. etc.
Another way we may rob God,
is to not give Him to honor, praise, worship, love etc.
He so deserves!!!
When we put a 'super bowl game'
( or any other event,
concert, entertainment, etc.
as a first priority
or a camping trip,
or sleeping in
etc.
and have little interest in going to church.
Plus, Christians have been compromising
in so many sins like :
sexual sins,
having other interests, as priority,
such as making lots of money
loving the world
etc.
Instead of reading, and studying God's Word, the Bible,
fellowshiping with other believers,
and in our relationship with Jesus...
not even having time to pray, being unaware:
7 The end of all things is at hand;
therefore be self-controlled
and sober-minded
for the sake of your prayers.
1 Peter 4:7
We also rob God, when we don't spread the gospel in anyway.
When we put other issues ahead of God like:
politics,
the environment,
save the whales ( or whatever)
social justice
etc.
Also when we don't obey God's Word
when we
store up excuses for ourselves,
and make exceptions as to
why we need to let some sins slide.
So we need to think about this verse:
32 But when we are judged by the Lord,
we are disciplined
so that we may not be condemned along with the world.
1 Corinthians 11:32
Being judged or disciplined are not words
people like.....
especially not in today's world
nor by many Christians!
Still, the purpose of God's
discipline
is first:
Justified
and
Second
Is for our benefit!!!
Lest, I am misunderstood
this is not an appeal, saying we must
work harder, give more etc.
it is first and foremost
a heart issue
If we gave all our money to the church
begudingly and spent all our time reading God's word but hating every minute
3 If I give away all I have,
and if I deliver up my body to be burned,
but have not love, I gain nothing.
1 Corinthians 13:3
We have most of all robbed God of love
and thus do not know, how to do right.
Done for today.
What you said was good and interesting! thank you! May I make a suggestion? I think it would be good to continue with this and simply look and see what other things the Lord may say that people are or should or shouldn't "store up". Some examples might be, Romans 2:5, Colossians 1:5, James 5:3, Matthew 6:19–20, Matthew 6:26, Matthew 12:35–37, Luke 12:17–21, Psalm 31:19, Proverbs 2:1, Proverbs 7:1, Proverbs 10:14, Proverbs 13:22, Hosea 13:12, Micah 6:14. All of these are from the NIV version. It would be helpful if you're getting your scriptures online if you could switch the Bible to NIV instead of the ESV for now. (But if you can't figure out how to do that, it's ok lol).
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 15, 2020 13:05:30 GMT -5
I did not sleep even a wink last night
so I am actually
falling asleep while writing this
I fear the Bible Study will be either messed up
due to falling asleep...
or
I will have to keep it
short and sweet
today????
Plus, I think I pinched a nerve in my back
the other day
and I had to take more muscle relaxers
and more pain meds
( I take very very very few any more)
But I was in a LOT of pain in my shoulder blade area yesterday
Oddly,
today
it is my lower lungs
that have discomfort....????
which I have never had before?
The pain in my should area was just on one side
so all in all it's wierd
but while typing this even
i fell asleep
a few times
So I am thinking short and sweet
I will try to get to a few of the verses
but actually do the Lion's share
tomorrow
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 15, 2020 13:21:58 GMT -5
Oh wow, I am falling asleep even more and more sigh!
Anyway, for the Romans 2:5 verse
I kind of want to post both versions:
This is the ESV version:
5 But because of your hard and impenitent heart
you are storing up wrath
for yourself
on the day of wrath
when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
And this is the NIV version:
5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart,
you are storing up wrath
against yourself
for the day of God’s wrath,
when his righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
i first wanted to mention
you pointed out a great point to me
When people 'hoard'
they are for the most part,
not willing to share with other people
( certainly not those who are wanting to steal
but they have a hardened and unwavering heart,
that won't take pity or compassion
on those dying of starvation
due to selfishness and pride
( they hoarded, these losers did not
so they get what they get coming to them....starvation)
even to the point of using guns etc.
against dying others....
And this is a grievous sin
and a stubborn and impenitent heart
Instead of:
3 Do nothing out of selfish ambition
or vain conceit.
Rather, in humility
value others
above yourselves,
4 not looking to your own interests
but each of you to the interests of the others.
5 In your relationships with one another,
have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:
Philippians 2:3-5
Instead this has become true of hoarders
that have no intention of sharing
with others:
3 All of us also lived among them at one time,
gratifying the cravings of our flesh
and following its desires
and thoughts.
Like the rest, we were by nature
deserving of wrath.
Ephesians 2:3
I literally a constantly falling asleep
and am in pain
so I am done for Today
sorry
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Post by oliverwithatwist on Dec 16, 2020 10:10:45 GMT -5
Praying you feel better very soon. I enjoy reading your thoughts and writings.
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Post by Cindy on Dec 16, 2020 11:53:21 GMT -5
I did not sleep even a wink last night
so I am actually
falling asleep while writing this
I fear the Bible Study will be either messed up
due to falling asleep...
or
I will have to keep it
short and sweet
today????
Plus, I think I pinched a nerve in my back
the other day
and I had to take more muscle relaxers
and more pain meds
( I take very very very few any more)
But I was in a LOT of pain in my shoulder blade area yesterday
Oddly,
today
it is my lower lungs
that have discomfort....????
which I have never had before?
The pain in my should area was just on one side
so all in all it's wierd
but while typing this even
i fell asleep
a few times
So I am thinking short and sweet
I will try to get to a few of the verses
but actually do the Lion's share
tomorrow
Oh wow, I am falling asleep even more and more sigh!
Anyway, for the Romans 2:5 verse
I kind of want to post both versions:
This is the ESV version:
5 But because of your hard and impenitent heart
you are storing up wrath
for yourself
on the day of wrath
when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
And this is the NIV version:
5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart,
you are storing up wrath
against yourself
for the day of God’s wrath,
when his righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
i first wanted to mention
you pointed out a great point to me
When people 'hoard'
they are for the most part,
not willing to share with other people
( certainly not those who are wanting to steal
but they have a hardened and unwavering heart,
that won't take pity or compassion
on those dying of starvation
due to selfishness and pride
( they hoarded, these losers did not
so they get what they get coming to them....starvation)
even to the point of using guns etc.
against dying others....
And this is a grievous sin
and a stubborn and impenitent heart
Instead of:
3 Do nothing out of selfish ambition
or vain conceit.
Rather, in humility
value others
above yourselves,
4 not looking to your own interests
but each of you to the interests of the others.
5 In your relationships with one another,
have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:
Philippians 2:3-5
Instead this has become true of hoarders
that have no intention of sharing
with others:
3 All of us also lived among them at one time,
gratifying the cravings of our flesh
and following its desires
and thoughts.
Like the rest, we were by nature
deserving of wrath.
Ephesians 2:3
I literally a constantly falling asleep
and am in pain
so I am done for Today
sorry
Praying you feel better very soon. I enjoy reading your thoughts and writings. |
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 16, 2020 12:31:12 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy
and hey! Oliver...thank you so much :)
I am 'better' today......
not perfect,
but then,
I don't expect that until I get my new body :)
Most nights
( in the winter at least,)
our cat and 1/2 a cat
( sharing neighbor's cat LOL)
are pleased to stay inside,
out of the rain and cold
but it did not rain last night.....
so they did some in and outs. sigh!
And some nights,
I don't wake up
having to go several times
to the bathroom
but I did last night
( maybe because I had to get up anyway,
being the cat's doorman...door woman)
Still all that to say, I do feel better
but still a bit tired
so hopeful not toooooo many mistakes today.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
|
Post by fearnot on Dec 16, 2020 13:20:23 GMT -5
I will try to get a bit further today
on looking at the two verses below
and the difference between:
storing up
and
hoarding up.
This is the ESV version:
5 But because of your hard and impenitent heart
you are storing up wrath
for yourself
on the day of wrath
when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
And this is the NIV version:
5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart,
you are storing up wrath
against yourself
for the day of God’s wrath,
when his righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
As I mentioned yesterday
hoarding tends to be
selfish and without compassion
A person who hoards
is hoarding material items
as a cushion for themselves
in the future,,,
and so,
in a sense,
they become
'rich'
But Jesus said this about 'rich' men:
( and woman LOL)
23 And Jesus said to his disciples,
“Truly, I say to you,
only with difficulty
will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.
24 Again I tell you,
it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle
than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”
Matthew 19:23,24
Well, that does not seem to promising!
However
storing up,
is for self,
and
often for others...
it can be in both
a 'material
and
spiritual manner.
19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth,
where moth and rust destroy
and where thieves break in and steal,
20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven,
where neither moth nor rust destroys
and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Matthew 6:19-21
So, I think 'hoarding' is mainly
a self-centered, selfish matter,
and
'storing up' is more,
a 'heart' concern with potential
'spiritual results.
Yes, we may store up for ourselves
and our family...
but also
for those who do not have,
and are in need
By doing so, we are in a spiritual way
giving to Jesus!!!!
34 Then the King will say to those on his right,
‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father,
inherit the kingdom prepared for you
from the foundation of the world.
35 For I was hungry and you gave me food,
I was thirsty and you gave me drink,
I was a stranger and you welcomed me,
36 I was naked and you clothed me,
I was sick and you visited me,
I was in prison and you came to me.’
37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying,
‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you,
or thirsty and give you drink?
38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you,
or naked and clothe you?
39 And when did we see you sick
or in prison and visit you?’
40 And the King will answer them,
‘Truly, I say to you,
as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,
you did it to me.’
Matthew 25
So again, we see it has
an issue of the heart,
not a hardened heart...
but compassionate and filled with love.
Sometimes, it hard not to be like the brother of the prodigal son.
After all, he worked hard
he did not go out and spend all his inheritance
and so it can cross one's mind to say:
he ( or she) made her bed
so now lie in it!!!
But that is a hardened heart....
like this:
28 ....he was angry and refused to go in.
His father came out and entreated him,
29 but he answered his father, ‘
Look, these many years I have served you,
and I never disobeyed your command,
yet you never gave me a young goat,
that I might celebrate with my friends.
30 But when this son of yours came,
who has devoured your property with prostitutes,
you killed the fattened calf for him!’
Luke 15:28-30
The older son's 'facts' were not wrong!
It was his heart that was wrong
and as such,
that hardened heart
was lacking in
love and compassion.
I can see the potential for this very attitude
in some preppers
The have read scripture....
They consider even this pandemic as a possible sign
of the future
as a sign that extremely hard times are coming,
in the not so distant future.
They know the 'facts 'of what is coming.
Most preppers have worked very very hard
to scrimp and save
and hoard ,
for the coming future!
Other,
non prepping people,
have NOT chosen to prepare.
Preppers may say or think:
It's their choice,
but then, don't come crying to me
when you are dying
as a result of your foolishness!
Perhaps will be said with gun in hands
But preppers may feel:
why, should I share?
When others are choosing to spend
and fritter away their money...
on nice cars, houses, jewelry,
computers etc etc etc etc.
and
all manner of sins ( like drugs, drink, sex etc).
Again, their 'facts' may be
or will be,
in the future
correct....
and
Again,
it's a heart issue
Yes, many people are foolish!!!
However, are the preppers
at least in part,
guilty of this?
15 Do not love the world
or the things in the world.
If anyone loves the world,
the love of the Father is not in him.
1 John 2:15
One problem is the hoarders are prioritizing their
saving and hoarding to
protect
and
give them security
in a fallen world,
that IS going to get worse.
They are trusting material things
as their first prioriy...
and not God.
They have lost sight of what is truly valuable.
17 But if anyone has the world's goods
and sees his brother in need,
yet closes his heart against him,
how does God's love abide in him?
1 John 3:17
Did not God forgive us our
( and preppers)
many many many foolish and evil sins?
Done for today
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Post by Cindy on Dec 17, 2020 10:33:25 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy
and hey! Oliver...thank you so much :)
I am 'better' today......
not perfect,
but then,
I don't expect that until I get my new body :)
Most nights
( in the winter at least,)
our cat and 1/2 a cat
( sharing neighbor's cat LOL)
are pleased to stay inside,
out of the rain and cold
but it did not rain last night.....
so they did some in and outs. sigh!
And some nights,
I don't wake up
having to go several times
to the bathroom
but I did last night
( maybe because I had to get up anyway,
being the cat's doorman...door woman)
Still all that to say, I do feel better
but still a bit tired
so hopeful not toooooo many mistakes today.
I will try to get a bit further today
on looking at the two verses below
and the difference between:
storing up
and
hoarding up.
This is the ESV version:
5 But because of your hard and impenitent heart
you are storing up wrath
for yourself
on the day of wrath
when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
And this is the NIV version:
5 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart,
you are storing up wrath
against yourself
for the day of God’s wrath,
when his righteous judgment will be revealed.
Romans 2:5
As I mentioned yesterday
hoarding tends to be
selfish and without compassion
A person who hoards
is hoarding material items
as a cushion for themselves
in the future,,,
and so,
in a sense,
they become
'rich'
But Jesus said this about 'rich' men:
( and woman LOL)
23 And Jesus said to his disciples,
“Truly, I say to you,
only with difficulty
will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.
24 Again I tell you,
it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle
than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.”
Matthew 19:23,24
Well, that does not seem to promising!
However
storing up,
is for self,
and
often for others...
it can be in both
a 'material
and
spiritual manner.
19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth,
where moth and rust destroy
and where thieves break in and steal,
20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven,
where neither moth nor rust destroys
and where thieves do not break in and steal.
21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Matthew 6:19-21
So, I think 'hoarding' is mainly
a self-centered, selfish matter,
and
'storing up' is more,
a 'heart' concern with potential
'spiritual results.
Yes, we may store up for ourselves
and our family...
but also
for those who do not have,
and are in need
By doing so, we are in a spiritual way
giving to Jesus!!!!
34 Then the King will say to those on his right,
‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father,
inherit the kingdom prepared for you
from the foundation of the world.
35 For I was hungry and you gave me food,
I was thirsty and you gave me drink,
I was a stranger and you welcomed me,
36 I was naked and you clothed me,
I was sick and you visited me,
I was in prison and you came to me.’
37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying,
‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you,
or thirsty and give you drink?
38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you,
or naked and clothe you?
39 And when did we see you sick
or in prison and visit you?’
40 And the King will answer them,
‘Truly, I say to you,
as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,
you did it to me.’
Matthew 25
So again, we see it has
an issue of the heart,
not a hardened heart...
but compassionate and filled with love.
Sometimes, it hard not to be like the brother of the prodigal son.
After all, he worked hard
he did not go out and spend all his inheritance
and so it can cross one's mind to say:
he ( or she) made her bed
so now lie in it!!!
But that is a hardened heart....
like this:
28 ....he was angry and refused to go in.
His father came out and entreated him,
29 but he answered his father, ‘
Look, these many years I have served you,
and I never disobeyed your command,
yet you never gave me a young goat,
that I might celebrate with my friends.
30 But when this son of yours came,
who has devoured your property with prostitutes,
you killed the fattened calf for him!’
Luke 15:28-30
The older son's 'facts' were not wrong!
It was his heart that was wrong
and as such,
that hardened heart
was lacking in
love and compassion.
I can see the potential for this very attitude
in some preppers
The have read scripture....
They consider even this pandemic as a possible sign
of the future
as a sign that extremely hard times are coming,
in the not so distant future.
They know the 'facts 'of what is coming.
Most preppers have worked very very hard
to scrimp and save
and hoard ,
for the coming future!
Other,
non prepping people,
have NOT chosen to prepare.
Preppers may say or think:
It's their choice,
but then, don't come crying to me
when you are dying
as a result of your foolishness!
Perhaps will be said with gun in hands
But preppers may feel:
why, should I share?
When others are choosing to spend
and fritter away their money...
on nice cars, houses, jewelry,
computers etc etc etc etc.
and
all manner of sins ( like drugs, drink, sex etc).
Again, their 'facts' may be
or will be,
in the future
correct....
and
Again,
it's a heart issue
Yes, many people are foolish!!!
However, are the preppers
at least in part,
guilty of this?
15 Do not love the world
or the things in the world.
If anyone loves the world,
the love of the Father is not in him.
1 John 2:15
One problem is the hoarders are prioritizing their
saving and hoarding to
protect
and
give them security
in a fallen world,
that IS going to get worse.
They are trusting material things
as their first prioriy...
and not God.
They have lost sight of what is truly valuable.
17 But if anyone has the world's goods
and sees his brother in need,
yet closes his heart against him,
how does God's love abide in him?
1 John 3:17
Did not God forgive us our
( and preppers)
many many many foolish and evil sins?
Done for today
I think another thing preppers and the rest of us who worry about having enough to eat forget is what Jesus told us: ““Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes?” (Matthew 6:25)
Then finally He says: “So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.” (Matthew 6:31–33)
To me these scriptures are saying that it's sin to storing up things or hoarding things out of fear or worry. God does expect us to use our brains. If we know a bad storm is coming then we should make provision for it. But if we're making provision for things that "might" happen in the future "sometime", maybe...that's like superstition and not something that honors God. Instead it simply shows that we're fearful, which means we're not trusting God. Instead we should realize that our God loves us more then we can even imagine. If He didn't love us like that, He surely wouldn't have sent Jesus to save us! Further more, He tells us numerous times that He will provide for our needs, and that we have no reason to worry or fear as long as we are saved and abiding in Him. (By the way, when I write things, I'm writing to myself as well as to anyone who might read what I write, so please don't think that I think I've learned it all already...I haven't!)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 17, 2020 12:54:56 GMT -5
Well, onto the next verses you posed
concerning 'hoarding' and 'storing up',
This next verse is more of
the spiritual aspect of storing up:
ESV version:
5 because of the hope laid up for you in heaven.
Of this you have heard before
in the word of the truth, the gospel,
Colossians 1:5
NIV
5 the faith and love
that spring from the hope
stored up for you
in heaven
and about which you have already heard
in the true message of the gospel
Colossians 1:5
What is 'stored up',
or 'laid up', in this verse is
the Word ( the Bible)
God's Word
the Truth,
The gospel
and with it:
hope
faith
and
love.
Those are of far more value,
than any material item!
And go along nice with the next verse:
NIV version
3 Your gold and silver are corroded.
Their corrosion will testify against you
and eat your flesh like fire.
You have hoarded wealth in the last days.
James 5:3
ESV version
3 Your gold and silver have corroded,
and their corrosion
will be evidence against you
and will eat your flesh like fire.
You have laid up treasure in the last days.
James 5:3
This is or should be quite alarming!
Why would God say this?
I think because people
who are hoarding,
are relying on self
material things
and
not God....
The more they hoard
The greater the testimony
they do not trust God.
Their 'real' God: is money
( things, food, etc.)
I think people either do not believe this next verse
because after all just look around at all the homeless....
(but then, why are many of them homeless?)
or people
'sort of'
believe it...
But then, feel they need to hoard up
just to be on the 'safe side'
or
perhaps some folks,
don't feel as valuable as birds?
ESV version
26 Look at the birds of the air:
they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns,
and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.
Are you not of more value than they?
Matthew 6:26
NIV version
26 Look at the birds of the air;
they do not sow or reap or store away in barns,
and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.
Are you not much more valuable than they?
Matthew 6:26
In the beginning, God did not make stores
and yet people lived.
There are even people today
who live 'totally' off the land
Even if we stored up enough
to keep us to our last days on earth
We do not want this to be our lot
You shall eat,
but not be satisfied,
and there shall be hunger within you;
you shall put away,
but not preserve,
and what you preserve I will give to the sword.
Micah 6:14
or this verse
36 For what does it profit a man
to gain the whole world
and forfeit his soul?
Mark 8:36
However, there have been more times in my life
(when we were without a dime, or had very little)
And then,
we 'found' money tucked away
forgotten in a drawer,
or
a letter came with money in the mail,
We once found over $100 on a walk
( the police said keep it if
after a week, no one called them about the loss....
no one ever did)
etc etc.
I am sure others have many such examples
That prove this verse:
Oh, how abundant is your goodness,
which you have stored up for those who fear you
and worked for those who take refuge in you,
in the sight of the children of mankind!
Psalms 31:19
Once again, on a more spiritual level:
NIV
35 A good man
brings good things out of the good stored up in him,
and an evil man
brings evil things out of the evil stored up in him.
36 But I tell you that everyone
will have to give account
on the day of judgment
for every empty word they have spoken.
37 For by your words you will be acquitted,
and by your words you will be condemned.”
Matthew 12:35-37
That says to me, we need to be careful how we speak
because our words are being stored up
Instead, these are the words we want 'stored up':
My son, if you receive my words
and treasure up my commandments with you,
Proverbs 2:1
Done for Today
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Post by Cindy on Dec 18, 2020 10:29:17 GMT -5
Sorry guys, I hate having to miss this! but...we got several feet of snow which isn't a real problem but it's been bitterly cold and now all our pipes are frozen, so I need to stay on "warming the pipes" patrol.... be back tomorrow or later today if possible....can't say for sure as it's not supposed to warm up anytime soon.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 18, 2020 11:12:51 GMT -5
Thank you again Oliver!!! :)
Wow! Cindy, that does not sound like much fun!
We saw on the net, that you all, were going to get a ton of snow
and so you did!!!
Take care, and stay warm....and also the pipes!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 18, 2020 12:30:18 GMT -5
Continuing to look at the
Covid 19, Pandemic
and issues, like hoarding and storing up...
17 Brothers, join in imitating me,
and keep your eyes on those
who walk according to the example you have in us.
18 For many, of whom I have often told you
and now tell you even with tears,
walk as enemies of the cross of Christ.
19 Their end is destruction,
their god is their belly,
and they glory in their shame,
with minds set on earthly things.
20 But our citizenship is in heaven,
and from it we await a Savior,
the Lord Jesus Christ,
21 who will transform our lowly body
to be like his glorious body,
by the power that enables him
even to subject all things to himself.
Philippians 3:17-21
and these verses:
7 But whatever gain I had,
I counted as loss
for the sake of Christ.
8 Indeed, I count everything as loss
because of the surpassing worth
of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord.
For his sake I have suffered the loss
of all things and count them as rubbish,
in order that I may gain Christ
9 and be found in him, ...
Philippians 3:7-9
One thing I notice, about these verses is:
there are two types of people, and examples, shown.
One type, has their minds
( and I would say their hearts )
on earthly things,
and their belly,
is their god.
The other counts material things
as 'rubbish'
( or as the NIV says 'garbage')
because, Jesus is infinitely more worthy.
So do we want real 'gain'
and
real 'profit'....
instead of loss (eternal loss)
then,
we want to hold on 'lightly'
to material items
Yes, we need 'things'
in order to live,
but not nearly as much as we believe:
But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with that.
1 Timothy 6:8
That is a totally shocking statement
in today's world!
I am not sure,
this means
we should all give up living in house,
and give away everything else we own!
I am pretty sure,
this is mainly, about
how attached we are to these things.
How devoted to material items are we,
over and above,
our 'love and devotion'
to our Lord and Savior.
And there is this verse:
Therefore I tell you,
do not be anxious about your life,
what you will eat or what you will drink,
nor about your body, what you will put on.
Is not life more than food,
and the body more than clothing?
Matthew 6:25
I am of the opinion,
that our being
soooo anxious about
'things',
that we believe we have to hoard,
years and years worth of all manner of material items,
and protect our immense stash,
with guns, locks, caves, etc.....
then,
We have made 'goods' and 'things'
our god.
However, if God blesses us
with money and material things
then it is an opportunity
to be able to do good to others!
Yes, to our own family first,
then,
to other believers who are in need
and then
to anyone, in need.
10 Therefore,
as we have opportunity,
let us do good to all people,
especially to those who belong to the family of believers.
Galatians 6:10
The reason we can 'joyfully' do this
is because, we are looking for
and storing up.....
'real' treasure:
44 “The kingdom of heaven
is like treasure hidden in a field,
which a man found and covered up.
Then in his joy he goes
and sells all that he has
and buys that field.
Matthew 13:44
Done for Today
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 7,168
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Post by fearnot on Dec 19, 2020 13:35:48 GMT -5
I thought I would post this one news item
not because I think it's the 'mark',
but because it seems a little like 'conditioning'
getting people to think
'marking' is a good idea...
That way, we will know
who took the shot
and those who did not.
But.....
Remember, the Jews had to wear a yellow star?
That was not such a great idea,
in fact,
in my mind it was very evil!
But it was a way,
to tell,
some people
from other people.
So this before I start the normal Bible study:
Andrew Yang Has a Really Scary Idea for Showing Proof of Coronavirus Vaccinations
Yang published an alarming tweet on Friday calling for Americans to show barcodes in order to prove they've been vaccinated for the Wuhan coronavirus
townhall.com/tipsheet/bronsonstocking/2020/12/18/yangs-call-for-proofofvaccination-barcodes-should-worry-all-freedom-loving-americans-n2581837
Well, back to what God says:
“The look on their faces testifies against them;
they parade their sin like Sodom;
they do not hide it.
Woe to them!
They have brought disaster upon themselves.
Tell the righteous it will be well with them,
for they will enjoy the fruit of their deeds.
Woe to the wicked! Disaster is upon them!
They will be paid back for what their hands have done.
Youths oppress my people,
women rule over them.
O my people, your guides lead you astray;
they turn you from the path.”
(Isaiah 3:9–12)
If one wonders if perhaps this pandemic is
a correction or judgment from God,
These verses in Isaiah point out some things to us.
Our faces can show a lot about us.
Things like pride, disdain for others we deem beneath us
if we are vain, are arrogant, self-centered etc.
Even someone who is into being
'sexual free'
and so they parade
in their pride
applauding themselves
and other
like minded.
Well, our country and the world
have been
( in my observations)
been sinning,
more and more
and
no longer 'hiding it'.
Neither men nor woman
hide their sins.
Woman have gone from having abortions
to boasting and celebrating them.
And on and on the sinning goes.
God says:
( unless of course,
the bold sinners and unbelievers,
are someday grieved
and repent
and ask forgiveness
being saved by Jesus)
otherwise
WOE to them!
For they have brought evil on themselves!
They are actually deserving of it.
their crimes have been open and bold
they have been proud and boasted of them.
And God says this:
Your evil will chastise you,
and your apostasy will reprove you.
Know and see that it is evil and bitter
for you to forsake the Lord your God;
the fear of me is not in you,
declares the Lord God of hosts.
Jeremiah 2:19
is this what we are starting to see
from God?
Even,,,,,,, if the righteous suffer
there are eternal benefits
as well, as benefits even while alive on earth....
Whatever the severity that God punishes
the atrocities of the nations.
The faithless will be fully repaid for their ways,
and the good rewarded for theirs.
Proverbs 14:14
Oh....I had meant to say
if anyone who might read this
and they are not a believer
I think there are two things....
( just for starts)
you may want to consider
The absolutely anomaly
of Israel becoming a nation again,
after almost 2,000 years
( predicted in the Bible)
And
the 'uniqueness' of our times
right now.
A pandemic that has shut down the economies
of every nation ( to some extent)
But those believers in the Bible
and the predicted End Times in scriptures
are not surprised.
Anyway, back to the original verses:
Youths oppressing the people
I can't help but think of
the 'peaceful'
( not so much)
protests we have seen
the overwhelming
'cancel culture'
the 'critical race theory'
the endless environmental push
and on and on
from the 'youth'
but no only America
but around the world.
In any case, youth ruling is madness
because....
enthusiasm and boldness,
don't always go together with,
wisdom and experience!
Unless, of course, they are like Timothy
which is not often the case:
Don’t let anyone look down on you because you are young,
but set an example
for the believers
in speech,
in conduct,
in love,
in faith
and
in purity.
1 Timothy 4:12
And woman, ruling over men
need I really address that?
We have been seeing the
Woman's lib, Me too, etc. etc.
movement for decades!
I think it speaks for itself
and started with Eve in the Garden of Eden.
All in all,
could God be beginning His corrections
and judgments?
Corrections
and judgment,
that will perhaps
soon,
led to the Rapture
and then,
the tribulation?
Its starting to look that way to me!
Nothing about this year has been easy
or a piece of cake.
But as we roll forward into the future
It may look that way,
in the future!
Done for Today
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) For example, “Speak to one another with psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Sing and make music in your heart to the Lord, always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.” (Ephesians 5:19–20) 
