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Post by Cindy on Aug 21, 2017 11:25:11 GMT -5
First see the thread: Barbara, The Joy of the Lord is my Strength
fresh-hope.com/thread/3256/barbara-joy-lord-strengthMy Plan with the Lord to overcome depression
1A. What (specific) steps to take in order to stop the depression or the feeling down upon waking once and for all?
I will start each night before, by praying, writing and start memorizing a scripture suitable concerning joy, beauty, aging etc. and find something to look forward to for the next day.
I will pray first thing upon awakening.
Morning starts with a smile.... to Jesus ( and hubby if he is around)
I will take any depressing thoughts or feelings captive and replace them with God's Word!
I will count my many blessings,
I will look at my scripture verse,
and speak the verse to myself,
I will recall what I am looking forward to:
- reading Christian fiction,
- watching Christian video/movies,
- shopping,
- gardening,
- Taking a walk
- going with Leonard to pick up Hossanah ( so I have time with her without kid interruptions)
- Listening to Christians hymns and worship songs
- watching Christian comedians
- getting a painting commission painting
- giving and leaving things for the homeless but especially including the bible, gospel message, tracts etc.
- having my time with Jesus as I study His word for an hour
I will remind myself that every day, even down to every minute, I am that much closer to being with Jesus in Heaven where I will have every tear wiped away, will never have to battle depression ever again and will have the joy and love of Jesus for ever more for all eternity.
My plan is to get up and do bathroom etc., get something to eat or not then I will bring that to eat while reading and studying.
I will read and study one book in Old testament and the next time in the New ( alternating back and forth).
1B. How will you know it's working?
It already is lessening .....so it will continue to go away ( and more so as joy takes its place....so they will work hand in hand).
2A. What specific steps will you take to overcome any depression that tries to attack you during the day?
I will take any depressing thoughts or feelings captive and replace them with God's Word
talk to Jesus about whatever the current depression is,
Note to myself how sometimes its rather silly and/or funny
sing or listen to hymns and songs,
quote scripture about joy,
count my blessings.
I will remind myself that every day, even down to every minute, I am that much closer to being with Jesus in Heaven where I will have every tear wiped away, will never have to battle depression ever again and will have the joy and love of Jesus for ever more for all eternity.
2B. How will you know it's working?
The depression will leave
others will notice and behave differently around me
Others will notice that I will be smiling more, and not frowning, grumbling, mumbling, being quiet but enjoying others and thinking of them, more than myself
joy, peace, contentment will replace the depression.
Others won't feel they have to walk on eggshells around me, and will actually want to be around me more
3A. What specific steps are you going to take in order to see age and aging the way the Lord wants us to?
search for and read scriptures that talk about it
I will continue to talk to Jesus about how He wants me to view aging and 'beauty'.
I will work on being more concerned about serving others.
I will continue to watch the Gaither's to see how much other Godly older people are loved, and how their inner beauty, character and love shows forth...as inspiration.
I will see myself the Lord sees me ( beauty tho it is different than when young)and look forward to eternity with God ( Jesus).
3B How will you know it's working?
I won't feel depressed, down, sad about it, but will also look forward to soon having a new and truly Godly beauty in Heaven
I will have stopped telling myself negative untrue things and will have replaced them with things like:
- There is no such thing as "age" in God's Kingdom
- I'm a beautiful daughter of God
- God has given me a purpose in life that's greater than even being president of the country!
- I'm so thankful that no one and nothing can take me out of my Lord's Hand!
I will tell myself what God tells me about those things from His Word
I will be more interested in the Lord and others, rather than always focused on my sad down feelings.
I will look forward to positive and joyful things
It will be easier to accept complements and actually believe that they're true.
4A. What specific steps are you going to take to prevent beauty from being an idol?
I will consciously look for the emptiness of beauty without the Lord"...not only emptiness but a burden and a joy stealer.
I will consciously look to see how beauty becomes an idol
I am going to continue to talk to Jesus more and more about everything....so my focus is less on 'me' more on His beauty.....but especially of His beauty in love.
I will see myself as a mirror, turned toward Jesus so I can reflect his glory, knowing I'm looking better every day as He changes me to be more like Him.
I will consciously choose to be satisfied and content with my looks
I will praise God and thank Him for creating me the way He did
4B. How or in what ways can you work on developing an inward beauty that the Lord loves instead of working on outward beauty?
I will concentrate on being gentle in my actions and speech towards others,
I will practice being kind, and compassionate to others,
I will be more loving towards others,
I will focus on humor instead of depression when talking with others,
I will be more giving to others ( both people I know and don't know)
4C. How will you know it's working?
people will be 'attracted' to me...(not in the way people are often attracted to just physical beauty, which often is more about being a trophy, and not even truly caring about the physically beautiful person) but a genuine interest because they feel safe, comfortable, comforted, cared about etc.
I will look less in the mirror except to comb hair, and other necessary things to be clean. I have already minimized any make up to go out to very little.
I will be be less critical of how others look
I will be content with my own looks
I will enjoy life, people and things more because I am not focused on how I look ( to the point I can't have fun less my hair or make up etc. gets messed up and I might look bad)
Leonard would worry less about me
People will notice that I'm more happy, upbeat, etc.
Leonard would notice that I think of him and his needs more often.
Leonard would notice that I want to be awake more.
I will have more energy.
5A. What specific steps are you going to take to experience the Joy of the Lord?
I will be grateful and thrilled that Jesus is ever with me and I will focus on that.
I will focus on knowing that Jesus loves me,
I will remind myself that I will soon be with Him in Heaven enjoying eternal pleasure and joy
I will reflect on what Heaven might be like especially about what the Bible tells us about it.
I will Praise God for His abundant spiritual resources, including joy.
Ask Him to help me apply them with wisdom & consistency.
Continue to listen to hymns and worship songs that are uplifting with Godly and biblical truths
Continue to study God's word the Bible daily
I will remind myself that God's Joy is available to me all the time, I just have to apply it by taking my thoughts and feelings captive and focusing on Him and His Truth about all He's given me as part of my salvation.
5B. How will you know it's working?
I won't be as tired mentally
and probably even physically to some extent because a lot of energy (if not more) goes into depression as joy
I will be content
I will be looking forward to Heaven and not so much concern about what the world thinks as important
I will be happy and joy filled in Jesus presence and His provisions and blessing daily.
I will feel more like singing about God, love, praise, might, provision, glory, power, protection. victory etc.
I will be grateful for all of the Lord's daily blessings.
I will be thrilled that even if I sin, Jesus will forgive me, I won't lose my salvation.
I will continue to grow in joy reading His Word.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426 
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Post by fearnot on Aug 21, 2017 21:55:31 GMT -5
I am not sure which day because since we are still cleaning the B & B sometimes we have to do a 4 hour turn around ( but yet I still have to do about 3 loads of wash afterwards).
At first Brent said he would not book any more turn arounds....
but then....
he said, he could not pass up the money...
Soooo....
I said, well how about we will clean.... all ....but the turn arounds....and he can clean the turn arounds...
and he agreed...
but then....
He decided we are doing so well at cleaning, we should do all the cleaning...soooooo
all that, to say....I never know what day will be a turn around.
However, in a month or two, it will slow waaaaay down....not many reservations
So I guess maybe Wed.
because
unless
someone leaves early
( which we prefer on a turn around we might have 5 or 6 hours to clean...much better for us)
We don't start cleaning until noon....
Therefore I ought to be able to go over the plan, sometime before noon.
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Post by Cindy on Aug 24, 2017 9:30:56 GMT -5
I am not sure which day because since we are still cleaning the B & B sometimes we have to do a 4 hour turn around ( but yet I still have to do about 3 loads of wash afterwards).
At first Brent said he would not book any more turn arounds....
but then....
he said, he could not pass up the money...
Soooo....
I said, well how about we will clean.... all ....but the turn arounds....and he can clean the turn arounds...
and he agreed...
but then....
He decided we are doing so well at cleaning, we should do all the cleaning...soooooo
all that, to say....I never know what day will be a turn around.
However, in a month or two, it will slow waaaaay down....not many reservations
So I guess maybe Wed.
because
unless
someone leaves early
( which we prefer on a turn around we might have 5 or 6 hours to clean...much better for us)
We don't start cleaning until noon....
Therefore I ought to be able to go over the plan, sometime before noon.
psalm 76 & 77
Yes, I read your post but have to read it over because, I was revising and adding to the plan ( some of your suggestions...I tired to get all of them but also need to re-check
and I did my personal bible study
but wanted to also go look at ephesians study now.
I was not very peppy today.... the day after a turn around cleaning of the B & B I am usually achy and tired and need a bit more rest....hopefully tomorrow I will be a bit more spry.
To keep myself awake longer I listened to a lot of gospel/worship music, and did some reading in a Christian novel and did some dishes
but ended up taking a nap anyway.
OH last night, I explained to Leonard about the code etc. and then read him you 'suggestions'.....but when I got to the 'throw something at him"
We both laughed.....he just knew I would latch onto that idea LOL (prob. my delighted and eager face was a bit of a give away) HA!
But actually....we are really thinking about something like that because he is in a different room...with headphones on....so throwing something noisy onto the floor ( or.....at him LOL) might work!!!
You don't need to go to any other thread. We're starting over and will do everything here. I've locked the other threads so you won't forget.
Good, I'm glad you're working it out. You'll have to change that part of your plan too, saying instead of "using a code word" what it is that you've decided to do.
I'll wait again now before doing any more until you've either told me that I misunderstood and you haven't changed your plan as it is here, (except for that part about Leonard) or that you have and you've quoted the one above and changed it so everything matches. (remembering to leave the colors and formatting the same)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 24, 2017 11:05:07 GMT -5
Nooo I meant...I added the new ideas to the plan you posted to the old shorter plan in my journal.....I did not change anything,
just added to it ( like when either you wrote some of my sentences in a better way, or asked me to think of more things...then added them...well the plan in my journal did not have those new things....so by revised, I meant 'added' to.
As soon as we figure out what might get his attention....we were thinking of maybe a plastic bottle with pebbles or marbles or something in it.....we might first, try it, and see if it actually works to get his attention ...over the earphones, with him listening to something, in the other room.
Yes, Wed. is the day.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 26, 2017 12:06:45 GMT -5
I am not sure where we will be studying Ephesians....anyway, I wrote my notes in my journal on what we have so far and today, I read Ephesians 1 twice.
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Post by Cindy on Aug 28, 2017 10:31:14 GMT -5
Nooo I meant...I added the new ideas to the plan you posted to the old shorter plan in my journal.....I did not change anything,
just added to it ( like when either you wrote some of my sentences in a better way, or asked me to think of more things...then added them...well the plan in my journal did not have those new things....so by revised, I meant 'added' to.
As soon as we figure out what might get his attention....we were thinking of maybe a plastic bottle with pebbles or marbles or something in it.....we might first, try it, and see if it actually works to get his attention ...over the earphones, with him listening to something, in the other room.
Yes, Wed. is the day. I am not sure where we will be studying Ephesians....anyway, I wrote my notes in my journal on what we have so far and today, I read Ephesians 1 twice.
The word “power” (dynamis; cf. 3:20) means a spiritually dynamic & living force. This power of God is directed toward believers. It is according to the working (energeian, “energetic power,” from which comes the Eng. “energy”) of the might (kratous, “power that overcomes resistance,” as in Christ’s miracles; this word is used only of God, never of believers) of God’s inherent strength (ischyos) which He provides (6:10; 1 Peter 4:11). This magnificent accumulation of words for power underscores the magnitude of God’s “great power” available to Christians.The Bible Knowledge Commentary
God’s great power, that very power which raised Jesus from the dead & lifted Him by ascension back to glory to take His seat at God’s right hand, is given to every believer at the time of salvation & is always available. Paul therefore did not pray that God’s power be given to believers but that they be aware of the power they already possessed in Christ & use it. The MacArthur study Bible
Paul focuses on 1 key feature of God’s power: His ability to secure the salvation of His people. He prays for you to understand the surpassing greatness of that truth.The Greek word translated power is dunamis, from which we get dynamite & dynamo. This power is active, dynamic & compelling—& it's mightily at work on your behalf. You might not always sense it, but it’s there. Peter expresses the same thought in 1 Peter 1:5, where he says you're protected by the power of God through faith in Christ. In that verse protected means to keep or guard & reflects Peter’s confidence that salvation is inviolable.The same limitless power that created, sustains, & controls the universe saved you & keeps you saved. Drawing Near—
Speaking of what faithless christians will be like today, Paul sums it up by saying: “having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.” (2 Timothy 3:5) These are the Christians that go to church, talk the talk, but aren't changed. They continue to live with their doubts, fears, and are just like the unsaved. Why? Because they don't even know it's available, much less that it should be working in them if they're really saved. These are the ones who will hear our Lord say, "Away from me, I never knew you!" (Matthew 7:23) This is part of what made me realize that I was missing something integral to being born again, because I hadn't been changed like Peter had. I knew most Christians weren't either, but realized that God never changes so even if there was no one that had been changed and continue to change, that the problem had to be with the people, not with God. It's what started me seeking God in His Word so I could learn the Truth.
“which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms,” (Ephesians 1:20)
Paul seems to want to use every word possible to convey to us the vastness of God’s power as found in Jesus Christ. Paul shares the exciting truth that this far above all power is available to us! It is even “above all that we ask or think.” In other words, the power of Christ, like the love of Christ, is beyond human understanding or measurement. And this is just the kind of power you & I need if we are to walk & war in victory. Some power is dormant; it is available, but not being used, such as the power stored in a battery. But God’s energy is effectual power—power at work in our lives. This power works in us, in the inner man (Eph. 3:16). Phil 2:12–13 are parallel verses, so be sure to read them. It is the Holy Spirit who releases the resurrection power of Christ in our lives. Unbelief, unconfessed sin, careless living, worldliness in action or attitude—all of these can rob us of power. And a Christian robbed of power cannot be used of God. “Without Me, ye can do nothing” (John 15:5). The Bible exposition commentary
That’s more than a truckload of love that God wants us to experience in our lives! It’s a love so big, it can drive fear from your life & fill the deepest cracks of your soul with satisfaction. A love that rests in knowing you’re His, secure in His care, wholeness, goodness, power, & restoration—His fullness. It is a love so powerful that it frees you to live in perfect security because Love Himself loves you. Thriving
“far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come.” (Ephesians 1:21)
The primary motive of the church is to glorify God. Paul described salvation as being “to the praise of the glory of his grace”(Eph. 1:6). Truth for today
to Him be the glory. Only when His children meet this level of faithfulness will Christ be fully glorified with the honor He deserves from His church. The MacArthur
We’ve experienced God’s saving power & seen Him answer prayer, & yet there are times when we let pessimism rob us of the joy of seeing Him work through obstacles in our lives. Don’t let that happen to you. Keep your eyes on Christ, & trust in His sufficiency. He will never fail you! Memorize Eph 3:20–21. Recite it often as a hymn of praise & affirmation of your faith in God. Drawing Near
Get your hands on your spiritual wealth by opening your heart to the Holy Spirit, and praying with Paul for strength for the inner man … for a new depth of love … for spiritual apprehension … and for spiritual fullness. “Ye have not because ye ask not” (James 4:2). The Bible exposition commentary
If you want those things, write your prayer in your notebook immediately. Remember too that you can also always use Paul's prayers for yourself (or others) too. You can use just a portion of Paul's prayer or all of the prayer. This is true for all of his many prayers. I use them all the time for myself and others.
“I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the Spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.” (Ephesians 1:17–23)
Tomorrow we can start on Ephesians 2.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 28, 2017 11:54:10 GMT -5
I wrote notes in my journal for today...thank you...looking forward for tomorrow (part of my 'joy' looking forward :-)
Oh you may think this silly ( or not).....
but the 22nd was our son's birthday.
We sent some money.....in a B-card I had bought.....
with a cross on the front
At first, I thought, opps, maybe that will make him upset.....
but then,
I thought about what you had said, about me being me ( A Christian who would most likely have such cards, for example)
And I sent it off
our son, just thanked us for the gift and no word of being upset....
to me it was a small victory ( soooo it was small victory/step LOL)
but still,
I thought, you never know.... what seed even an image ( the cross is a mighty strong 'image'), might plant ( in time).
So thank you.....I did not go out and buy a 'worldly card and it was ok.
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Post by Cindy on Aug 29, 2017 11:47:44 GMT -5
I wrote notes in my journal for today...thank you...looking forward for tomorrow (part of my 'joy' looking forward :-)
Oh you may think this silly ( or not).....
but the 22nd was our son's birthday.
We sent some money.....in a B-card I had bought.....
with a cross on the front
At first, I thought, opps, maybe that will make him upset.....
but then,
I thought about what you had said, about me being me ( A Christian who would most likely have such cards, for example)
And I sent it off
our son, just thanked us for the gift and no word of being upset....
to me it was a small victory ( soooo it was small victory/step LOL)
but still,
I thought, you never know.... what seed even an image ( the cross is a mighty strong 'image'), might plant ( in time).
So thank you.....I did not go out and buy a 'worldly card and it was ok.
I should have told you this yesterday, but I haven't been thinking to well lately as I've been in a lot of extra pain. Anyway, we need to change the format of you study time just a little bit now. So this is what I'd like you to do from this point on:
When you read your chapter in Ephesians (or part of it) what I'd like you to do is keep in mind that the Lord is giving you directions for how to carry out your plan. He's showing you what you will act like, be like, and how your life will look as you carry out your plan. He's showing you His plan for you and how He intends to change you to be more like Christ. He's also showing you how very much He loves you and cares about you and every little thing in your life. If it matters to you, no matter how insignificant it might seem to others, it matters to the Lord who loves you. He wants you to know the privileged position He's given you and what your purpose in life is now. Therefore, this book is showing you your new identity, your purpose in life, your Father and your family, which you are now an integral part of.
During and after reading the chapter or portion of it, you should be talking to the Lord about what you've read and how you can apply it to your life - how it will help you carry out your plan, or in what way it's part of your plan, etc. In other words, you should be reflecting on what you read so you can know these things and how they apply to you.
When you post about your study time, I'd like you to tell me what chapter or portion of the chapter you read and what you felt was most important to you from it and how you intend to use it to help you in your plan.
You didn't say what you read, so I don't know if you've already read Ephesians chapter 2 or not...or if you just read part of it. So I'm not sure what to do..... I guess, in case you've already read some or all of it, I'll post some about it.
This verse stood out to me right away: “All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath.” (Ephesians 2:3) What do we see people doing constantly today, even Christians? They're following their desires and and thoughts. According to the dictionary, a craving is an intense, urgent, or abnormal desire or longing. And we know what kind of things the sinful nature craves as they're listed in a number of places including Galatians 5:19–21. All the lists, including that one, are only partial lists given as examples so we'll know others when we see them. Because we've been born again, we are to live for Christ and not for ourselves. Therefore we're to follow after His desires and thoughts, which we obviously learn as we study His Word. The first thing He teaches us is that it's His will that we live for others and think of them as being more important than we ourselves are. So we're to put others needs and desires ahead of our own, especially those who are part of God's family.
In the very next verse Paul begin to show us just how much God loves us. In verse 6 we're told: “And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,” (Ephesians 2:6) Because of God's love for us, we're not only dead to sin and alive to righteousness through our Lord's resurrection, but we also get to enjoy our lord's exaltation and share in His glory. When we were saved we died with Jesus; everything about "us" died in that instant. Our life before our salvation was wiped away with all it's sins, and we were given a brand new life to live - a life to live for Jesus instead of ourselves. But that's not all. We not only died with Him, we were also resurrected with Him, which is why we now have that new life to live, and why we live for Him and not ourselves. Being raised up with Christ, resurrected with Him, is a picture of what happened to us. When Jesus was raised from the dead, His new position or state was new, powerful and unique. Being raised with Him shows us that we now have a new, powerful and unique life and position as well. Speaking of this to the Colossians, Paul said, “Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your heart on things above, where Christ is seated at the right hand of God. Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things” (Col. 3:1-2) I like how The Bible Knowledge Commentary puts this: "We're no longer mere earthlings; our citizenship is in heaven. He's the exalted Son of God, and we're the exalted sons & daughters of God. What God did for us is similar to what He did for Christ. Whereas Christ had died physically, unbelievers were dead spiritually. While Christ was raised physically, unbelievers are made alive & raised with Christ spiritually (2:5-6). Christ is seated in the heavenly realms physically (in His resurrected, ascended body), but believers are seated with Christ in the heavenly realms spiritually. This divine power that can make an unbeliever have life, be raised, & exalted with Christ is the same power that presently operates in believers."
When we reflect on all of this, it's really exciting. Like Lazarus, we too have been called from the grave to sit with Christ and enjoy His fellowship. (John 12:1–2) We now share in His life (which includes suffering) and we will also share in His glory. Our position in Him gives us both present and future victory! (Romans 8:37)
Being seated with Him is talking about reigning with Him. Since the moment we were saved, we have been co-reigning with Christ in the heavenlies. (Romans 5:17; 2 Timothy 2:12; Revelation 22:5) Let me quote what MacArthur says about the heavenly realms: The supernatural realm where God reigns. In Ephesians 3:10 and Ephesians 6:12, however, it also refers to the supernatural sphere where Satan temporarily rules. This spiritual realm is where believers’ blessings are (Ephesians 1:3), their inheritance is (1 Peter 1:4), their affections should be (Col 3:3), & where they enjoy fellowship with the Lord. It is the realm from which all divine revelation has come & where all praise & petitions go.
All of this makes me think that perhaps our prayers are part of how we are reigning with Him! As we reign with Him, perhaps we see that we'd like to have this person receive mercy and another justice, another healing, and another salvation, so we pray & the Lord follows through on our prayers. (if they're in His Will since our minds are not yet pure & won't be until we actually get to heaven).
Since I don't know what you've read, I'll end this here. But I do want to tell you a story about my daughter that she reminded me of the other day that may help you. I'd forgotten all about this incident, but she was reminded of it when a little one she was babysitting did the same thing.
Jennifer was about 5 years old when this happened. Since she was my last child, I'd never taught her like I had the others, how to handle babies. Mainly because I not only knew I wouldn't have anymore but also because I was too busy trying to teach her to do the things that children of that age are supposed to be able to do but she couldn't because of the cerebral palsy. So even if I'd wanted to, I couldn't have taught her that yet anyway. We had 5 cats at this time. (we've always seemed to have a bunch of them lol) Jenn wanted to take the cat into her room, so she picked it up and started to carry it in there. That's when I caught her at it. She was holding the poor thing by it's neck! No, I didn't yell at her. I simply quickly supported the rest of the cats body and told her to let go and I'd help her. When she let go, I explained to her that she couldn't carry cats that way because they couldn't breathe when she did that. I was busy at the time, so didn't go on to any great lengths, just quickly told her not to do it again and left her to play. Well she did do it again, several more times. Each time I'd catch her and again tell her not to do it and again try and explain why it was wrong and what the right way to carry a cat was. Because of the CP, many things were hard for her to understand so getting her to understand things always took some time. Then, one day, I just happened to look up to see her carrying her doll into another room and she was holding the doll the same way! Now I knew at least part of the reason she wasn't "getting it", she thought it was OK to carry the doll that way! Since the doll obvious wasn't alive, I'd never said anything about it, but now I needed to and did. Once I'd explained that babies also couldn't be handled like that and showed her the correct way to hold them, she never carried the cat by grabbing it around the neck again.
When Jenn reminded me of this, I was stunned I'd forgotten all about it, but instantly knew I had to tell you about it to show you that what you did was totally normal and completely innocent. I think I told you long ago that little ones often carry their dolls that way, the only reason my kids learned not to was because I was always pregnant and bringing a new baby home each year and so I'd teach them the right way to hold a baby. All except for Jennifer anyway. So here's another little bit of Truth to chip away at Satan's lie. And yes, in spite of the way Jennifer carried the cats, they were always just fine afterward. They didn't even try to avoid her, which I thought was rather weird lol. I think even they understood that she didn't mean to hurt them.
Remember the song I told you about quite some time ago? Here it is again, because I'd like you to save it so you can always turn to it and listen to it when you need a reminder.
Ephesians Chapter One By Karen Peck and New River
If you want the lyrics, they're in the thread about Ephesians. |
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 29, 2017 16:58:13 GMT -5
I am about to read your post today....sorry, I forgot to tell you that yes I did read ephesians 2 ( 3 times so far.....once just to get an over all view, then more carefully....and once again to be more careful.....but I did not yet read it with the intent of how it will help me carry out my plan.
So I will read your post and then read it again with the plan in mind. and will post.
Oh our landlord sent us a text telling us how much the rent increase will be....it will be a $400 increase....oh now it says $200!!!
Oh well, which ever amount.....this is an opportunity to trust the Lord.
Hossanah also got a biggish increase too.
One of the things I am going to start doing ( irregardless, of if we stay, or go rent elsewhere), is to start downsizing of 'stuff' and things.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 29, 2017 18:26:14 GMT -5
I am not sure I am following directions here...I know you will kindly correct me, if I don't get it right today :-)
So I am re-reading Ephesian 2 thinking about my plan but specially ( at least today) in terms of 'joy'.
v. 4 & 5
Stood out as reasons for me to have joy:
v. 4 & 5
"But because of his great love for us ( me), God, who is rich in mercy,
5 made us (me) alive with Christ even when we (I) were dead in transgressions"
Also v. 6 is a reason for joy
"seated us (me) with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
And v.8 is a reason for joy because even my faith is monsternot something I have to conjure up....it is a gift from God.
8 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God"
v. 18 Jesus is my peace another joyful things.
v. 19 " Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household"
I have an ever lasting household which is another reason for joy.
Thank you soooo much for telling me about Jennifer and the kitties. I keep hoping the Lord will tell the parents ( and the baby/adult) that I was not some kind of monster. I was going to write after the word monster...disobedient.....
but then
I saw that it took Jennifer several times to understand.....
I guess from time to time, I still grieve a little, that they thought I meant to kill the baby.
Even tho they had said, not to touch her,
when she started crying, it over rode 'obedience' because I wanted to 'help' her be happy and not sad/crying.....I related to crying and sad....all I could think was her mommy could help.
But to hear that another little one ( well 5 years old...that is also how old I was) did something similar...helped me see, I really was not a monster.....I knew I did not mean to hurt the baby, but I never heard of any other child doing that before today.
Did you see Eva wrote to us....I was sooooo happy to find out she was alive, and not physically hurt or anything. I do so hope she will come back and join us, but I am relieved she wrote us!!!
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Post by Cindy on Aug 30, 2017 11:31:33 GMT -5
I am not sure I am following directions here...I know you will kindly correct me, if I don't get it right today :-)
So I am re-reading Ephesian 2 thinking about my plan but specially ( at least today) in terms of 'joy'.
v. 4 & 5
Stood out as reasons for me to have joy:
v. 4 & 5
"But because of his great love for us ( me), God, who is rich in mercy,
5 made us (me) alive with Christ even when we (I) were dead in transgressions"
Also v. 6 is a reason for joy
"seated us (me) with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
And v.8 is a reason for joy because even my faith is monsternot something I have to conjure up....it is a gift from God.
8 "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God"
v. 18 Jesus is my peace another joyful things.
v. 19 " Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household"
I have an ever lasting household which is another reason for joy.
Thank you soooo much for telling me about Jennifer and the kitties. I keep hoping the Lord will tell the parents ( and the baby/adult) that I was not some kind of monster. I was going to write after the word monster...disobedient.....
but then
I saw that it took Jennifer several times to understand.....
I guess from time to time, I still grieve a little, that they thought I meant to kill the baby.
Even tho they had said, not to touch her,
when she started crying, it over rode 'obedience' because I wanted to 'help' her be happy and not sad/crying.....I related to crying and sad....all I could think was her mommy could help.
But to hear that another little one ( well 5 years old...that is also how old I was) did something similar...helped me see, I really was not a monster.....I knew I did not mean to hurt the baby, but I never heard of any other child doing that before today.
Did you see Eva wrote to us....I was sooooo happy to find out she was alive, and not physically hurt or anything. I do so hope she will come back and join us, but I am relieved she wrote us!!!
I'm glad Eva wrote to us too. At least now we know the truth. We'll have to wait and see what happens.
I'm so exhausted that I can't stay awake today so can't write anymore. I'll have to pick up where we left off tomorrow. I hope my notes from yesterday also helped you some.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 30, 2017 13:43:01 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy so much. I never thought about how the parents might have thought about their own safety. I never once thought they might protect themselves. But when you said that, I can see that being an aspect ( being I am an adult now).
The strange thing is, I truly believe they thought, I meant harm....because of the whole other issue:
eat your breakfast for a week, and we will get you a puppy.
That was the last day of the week.....of eat ALL of your breakfast....
and I could not finish it all.
That is why I believe they really thought what I did was revenge for not getting a puppy.
That and the fact, that when they came out....I was grinning....I was because I was so happy that the little baby would be happy now ( plus she was sooooo heavy...I kept trying not to let her feet drag on the ground and get dirty).
when they saw me smiling I think they interpreted that as:
HA you didn't get me a puppy ....so now I made you as unhappy too........
only thing is
I was disappointed, true but..
I had already...let it go....
I was already used to not having any real control in what happened in my life.....( Like moving from foster home to foster home....no matter if I was sad leaving about leaving this home or that... or not....I just accepted it because that was all there was to do).
Only last year, did I figure out.... that since I had only been with that foster home for a week,
and they had a brand new baby.....plus a foster kid
they probably did NOT want to deal with a puppy also.....
but
they 'needed' me to eat
( as it turned out I was filled with worms....my adopted mom brought me to a doctor and they discovered that)
But I was soooooooo thin...they used the puppy ploy LOL..... to encourage me to eat
Only I am wondering if that last day....they perhaps gave me waaaaay more food to eat than usual .....knowing, I could not finish it all...... and thus they could say: Oh well, no puppy then.
But its funny years and years later...God gave me the puppy....my beloved Airedale Shama.
Still, I never thought they might make sure there would be no repercussions the husband beating me ( and leaving their baby unattended)....
by portraying me as a child of satan, a devil, and a monster.
Oh Yikes......I am so sorry I did not tell you....yes your notes as always were so helpful!!!
but then....
there has NEVER EVER been a time,
they they have not been so helpful LOL :-)
Today, I read Ephesians 3 and studied it a bit...but I really wanted to get here and see what you wrote to Eva, plus of course come to our bible study.....so I did not do more that 15 mins or so......but I may go back now and re-read ch. 2 and 3
Thank you again for all you do.....I also learned by your post to Eva.....I wish I had had you to help me waaaay back in the day, when I was in college and beyond!!!!
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Post by Cindy on Aug 31, 2017 12:11:52 GMT -5
Thank you Cindy so much. I never thought about how the parents might have thought about their own safety. I never once thought they might protect themselves. But when you said that, I can see that being an aspect ( being I am an adult now).
The strange thing is, I truly believe they thought, I meant harm....because of the whole other issue:
eat your breakfast for a week, and we will get you a puppy.
That was the last day of the week.....of eat ALL of your breakfast....
and I could not finish it all.
That is why I believe they really thought what I did was revenge for not getting a puppy.
That and the fact, that when they came out....I was grinning....I was because I was so happy that the little baby would be happy now ( plus she was sooooo heavy...I kept trying not to let her feet drag on the ground and get dirty).
when they saw me smiling I think they interpreted that as:
HA you didn't get me a puppy ....so now I made you as unhappy too........
only thing is
I was disappointed, true but..
I had already...let it go....
I was already used to not having any real control in what happened in my life.....( Like moving from foster home to foster home....no matter if I was sad leaving about leaving this home or that... or not....I just accepted it because that was all there was to do).
Only last year, did I figure out.... that since I had only been with that foster home for a week,
and they had a brand new baby.....plus a foster kid
they probably did NOT want to deal with a puppy also.....
but
they 'needed' me to eat
( as it turned out I was filled with worms....my adopted mom brought me to a doctor and they discovered that)
But I was soooooooo thin...they used the puppy ploy LOL..... to encourage me to eat
Only I am wondering if that last day....they perhaps gave me waaaaay more food to eat than usual .....knowing, I could not finish it all...... and thus they could say: Oh well, no puppy then.
But its funny years and years later...God gave me the puppy....my beloved Airedale Shama.
Still, I never thought they might make sure there would be no repercussions the husband beating me ( and leaving their baby unattended)....
by portraying me as a child of satan, a devil, and a monster.
Oh Yikes......I am so sorry I did not tell you....yes your notes as always were so helpful!!!
but then....
there has NEVER EVER been a time,
they they have not been so helpful LOL :-)
Today, I read Ephesians 3 and studied it a bit...but I really wanted to get here and see what you wrote to Eva, plus of course come to our bible study.....so I did not do more that 15 mins or so......but I may go back now and re-read ch. 2 and 3
Thank you again for all you do.....I also learned by your post to Eva.....I wish I had had you to help me waaaay back in the day, when I was in college and beyond!!!!
Think about what they told you Barbara. "you have to eat ALL of it" They knew you couldn't and wouldn't, and said that so they wouldn't have to get you the puppy. They had no intention of ever getting you one. That's how they intended to get out of it. I wouldn't be surprised if they gave you a little extra just to be sure you wouldn't eat it all that day. It made them look good and kind in your eyes, and they never gave a thought of how it would make you feel bad about yourself. And yes, they may have thought you meant harm but ONLY IF they themselves would have done something to get even with someone who wouldn't give them something. That's what God's Word tells us about ourselves - remember the verse about "to the pure all things are pure"? (Titus 1:15) and many others. Basically, we accuse others of doing what we ourselves would do in a similar situation. If we are jealous of our spouse and even though there's no good reason to we often think they're cheating on us, it's generally because we ourselves have cheated on our spouse, or at least have considered doing so or would like to but haven't had the opportunity yet. If we get angry and accuse someone of stealing something from us, it's generally because we have stolen things from others and assume others act the same way, and so on. Therefore, they assumed you would want to hurt their baby, because if someone had refused to give them something they wanted, they would have tried to hurt them. See what I mean? We see others the way we see ourselves whether we realize it or not.
I had only read what you wrote here: "The strange thing is, I truly believe they thought, I meant harm....because of the whole other issue:
eat your breakfast for a week, and we will get you a puppy." before replying about it. I just now scrolled up and read the rest and saw that you too realized that they may have given you extra to eat. (I do that so I can reply to what you've said before I forget about it and start thinking of something else. - but eventually, I read your entire post lol)
Sadly, I'm sure they were busy protecting themselves and never gave a thought to how it would harm you. Many people, especially back then, thought that young children couldn't remember the things that happened to them when they were that young, and that it had no lasting effect. The main thought was that children in general, and little ones especially always bounced back from whatever happened to them, therefore whatever they did, wasn't going to really hurt you. By 1976, when people generally knew that wasn't true, I can remember what my doctor said when my second child was born - a boy and they wanted to circumcise him. I'll never forget how they told me that babies can't feel pain! I couldn't believe anyone could possibly believe that, but they certainly did. I waited outside the room where they did the procedure. All was quiet until suddenly I heard my baby screaming! No one could tell me he didn't feel pain, and boy was I angry! My point is though, that that attitude was a "left over" from the earlier belief that children would bounce back from anything without being affected by it. The reason I'm stressing this is because although the couple were protecting themselves and what they did was horrible - demonic even - it's also possible that they didn't think it would hurt you. Their thinking and their consciences were badly corrupted. Even if they didn't think it would hurt you, everything they called you - a Satan, a devil, demonic, a monster, is exactly what they were. It makes it hard to want to pray for their salvation even, because if they have been saved at some point, it means that they will have to face what they did to you and that will be a very, very heavy burden to bear. If they don't get saved though, they'll have to deal with it for all eternity, so I guess it's better to deal with it now then for eternity. I sure don't envy them, that's for sure as God doesn't take kindly to sin in general, but to things done to little children it's worse and worst of all are things done to little children who belong to Him, of which you were one. Even though you weren't yet saved, God knew that you belonged to Him and in His mind you were already saved, because He chose you before the foundation of the world. I love the way one of my books explains it. Let me quote it to give you something to reflect on that's pretty neat. Speaking of his own salvation Wiersbe says:
We have already noted that all three Persons in the Godhead are involved in our salvation. Perhaps this truth can help us better understand God’s part and our part in the miracle of salvation. As far as God the Father is concerned, I was saved when He chose me in Christ before the foundation of the world (Ephesians 1:4). Of course, I knew nothing about that choice. As far as God the Son is concerned, I was saved when He died for me on the cross; for He died for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:2). This is the message of the gospel, the good news that sinners can be saved. I had known that good news since childhood, but it never really struck home until one night at a Youth for Christ rally. I heard the evangelist as he preached the gospel, and I trusted Jesus Christ and was saved. So, as far as the Holy Spirit is concerned, I was saved that May night in 1945 when I responded to the Spirit’s call. Wiersbe, Prayer: Basic Training
We know many people who view others with suspicion. It's like they're just waiting for the person to do something to hurt them. Or they may think that everyone thinks they're ugly, or stupid, or whatever negative things they attach to themselves. Sadly many Christians are this way too, and even boast about it, as though it was good to be that way. Others speak of it as though they have no control over it. But both attitudes are lies from Satan. God tells us that we do have control over the way we think and feel, and the way we view others. He teaches us how to think, how to have the mind of Christ instead of the mind of this world, Satan and our flesh. All through the Bible He gives us examples people who are thinking the right way and those thinking the wrong way. He knows that all of us will be thinking the wrong way when we are saved. It's the only way we can think before salvation. But when we are saved, He gives us the ability to think the right way and have the mind of Christ. Some people think that once they're saved they automatically think like Christ or have His mind and that they don't have to do anything. Talk about a slippery slope! I'd hate to go where that path leads. Like everything else though, God expects us to work at it and to learn to think His way instead of our way.
OK about Ephesians, I need you to slow down lol. What I'd like you to do is to go back and read Ephesians 1 again, and then tell me how Ephesian 1 will help you with your plan. Not in general, but specifically. For example: I will become more joyful daily as I begin to understand more and more that God is working out everything in my life for the praise of His glory. (Ephesians 1:11–12)
and the next day read Ephesians two and do the same thing, and so on.
I wanted to include this for you too as it's a note I wrote to myself to remind you of when we started Ephesians this time:
As you study with the Lord each day, be listening for how you can apply what you studied to your plan. i thought this was a good description of it:
During my regular times in the Word, I often don’t know where Bible study ends and meditation begins, or where meditation turns into prayer. My devotions are definitely a seamless process in which I read Scripture, meditate on it, and pray that God would help me understand it. I’m sure that many of you have had the same experience. It ought to be like that for any believer who is faithful in spending time with the Lord daily. Strength for today.
When you think you can't discipline yourself, remember: “For God did not give us a spirit of timidity, but a spirit of power, of love and of self-discipline.” (2 Timothy 1:7) and recall that we regularly discipline ourselves to do all the things we want to do lol.
Thanks for letting me know you read what I wrote before hon. I appreciate it! See you tomorrow, God willing!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 31, 2017 13:01:30 GMT -5
I just want to say thank you for going over that incident once again....I just thought only the other day, that the man especially may have thought of revenge because perhaps he might have some aspects of that in his life.
I do honestly remember the event,
and I can say I truthfully say, I never thought of revenge....I don't think I had absolutely any concept of revenge at that age...
in fact,
revenge has never been something I ever thought of doing.
I am not saying I am incapable of it....I know as sinners we all could be capable of ANY sin......
I am just saying that, tho I have in the past, been supreme sinner in many other sins.....
to get revenge on someone was never my modus operandi.
You are so kind to me, to go over this yet again.....but it helps me so much...let go of it.....and to in a strange way forgive.
I do forgive them, and certainly pray they were saved at some point in their lives and also that the baby girl was ok and she too was saved.
For a long time, I wondered if maybe I had killed her....but my adopted mom only once brought it up ( I can't totally remember the context)
but I do remember she said:
'THEY' said, you tried to kill their baby.....
It took me a long time to remember that....but my mom said that they said I 'TRIED' to kill the baby....which I am pretty sure means the baby did NOT die.....or else she would have said.....you killed their baby.
But clearly the next day when the worker came to take me out of their home the baby was NOT there ( nor the husband)....but I can understand that.....either they kept the baby at the hospital for 'safety' sake or the doctors wanted to watch her for another day or hopefully she didn't not need surgery or something.
But I am thinking probably not...because the mom was at home....
if the baby had to have surgery, I would have thought she would have been at the hospital
and she would have gotten someone else ( a family member or a babysitter)
to be at the house, when the worker came to pick me up.
Anyway....I will go back to Ephesians 1 and 'try' to follow directions LOL
You ought to have been a dentist (pulling teeth and all LOL)
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Aug 31, 2017 21:58:31 GMT -5
I feel like I am not giving the Lord ( or you) my best, because it is latish and I am tired...on the other hand, I do not want to, not, do it.
So if necessary, I will work on it more or again tomorrow ( which seems to be par for the course, even when I do it in the morning) sigh!
When I start to feel depressed I will take those thoughts captive and replace it with the joy of knowing that I have been blessed in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ.
I will also remind myself that I was chosen before the Creation of world...just those two things are so incredibly awesome how can depression even begin?
Also I love the fact that I am twice adopted...first by human parents that actually wanted me, but even waaaaay more so by God the Father who loved me more than even any human could or can.
So when I start to feel depressed, I will replace gloomy thoughts and feelings with how much My Father in Heaven loves me, so much that He adopted me into His family.
I often feel so down when I sin ( not that it's wrong to grieve about sinning) but I also will replace what used to be endless berating myself about the sin, with the fact, that having confessed it, to know I am then instantly forgiven....I don't have to keep beating myself up.
Additionally I will remind myself I have been sealed and have the Holy Spirit...when I begin to see all the blessing and gifts I have been freely given they will help me turn from sorrow to joy.
Not only all these things will I remind myself of..
all these things I will replace the depressing thoughts with ( take them captive and replace them with the truth) I will also focus on the Lord's power which is so far beyond any that it in itself is a joyful thought.
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Post by Cindy on Sept 1, 2017 9:31:06 GMT -5
I just want to say thank you for going over that incident once again....I just thought only the other day, that the man especially may have thought of revenge because perhaps he might have some aspects of that in his life.
I do honestly remember the event,
and I can say I truthfully say, I never thought of revenge....I don't think I had absolutely any concept of revenge at that age...
in fact,
revenge has never been something I ever thought of doing.
I am not saying I am incapable of it....I know as sinners we all could be capable of ANY sin......
I am just saying that, tho I have in the past, been supreme sinner in many other sins.....
to get revenge on someone was never my modus operandi.
You are so kind to me, to go over this yet again.....but it helps me so much...let go of it.....and to in a strange way forgive.
I do forgive them, and certainly pray they were saved at some point in their lives and also that the baby girl was ok and she too was saved.
For a long time, I wondered if maybe I had killed her....but my adopted mom only once brought it up ( I can't totally remember the context)
but I do remember she said:
'THEY' said, you tried to kill their baby.....
It took me a long time to remember that....but my mom said that they said I 'TRIED' to kill the baby....which I am pretty sure means the baby did NOT die.....or else she would have said.....you killed their baby.
But clearly the next day when the worker came to take me out of their home the baby was NOT there ( nor the husband)....but I can understand that.....either they kept the baby at the hospital for 'safety' sake or the doctors wanted to watch her for another day or hopefully she didn't not need surgery or something.
But I am thinking probably not...because the mom was at home....
if the baby had to have surgery, I would have thought she would have been at the hospital
and she would have gotten someone else ( a family member or a babysitter)
to be at the house, when the worker came to pick me up.
Anyway....I will go back to Ephesians 1 and 'try' to follow directions LOL
You ought to have been a dentist (pulling teeth and all LOL)
As to the husband and baby not being there, it's possible that they kept the baby overnight for observation, and it's also possible they kept the baby to see if there were any signs of abuse on her from the father, and that is VERY likely! Because if the father would abuse you, it's just as likely he'd abuse his child too. (that's how they've always operated) As far as the father goes, it's VERY possible he was in jail and that's why he wasn't there. No matter how you look it it, everything points to the baby being fine and the father being in a lot of trouble. The wife may well have been in trouble as well, most likely for child neglect (both of you and her own baby) and child endangerment and possibly as an accessory to child abuse. It would have been easier for her to get out of it though by claiming she was afraid to go against her husband, at which they would have likely reduced the sentence or more likely put her on probation. (although the trial wouldn't happen for quite some time).
I don't mind talking about it hon, if it will help you. I know the Lord wants you to be at peace about this, and of course so do I.
I feel like I am not giving the Lord ( or you) my best, because it is latish and I am tired...on the other hand, I do not want to, not, do it.
So if necessary, I will work on it more or again tomorrow ( which seems to be par for the course, even when I do it in the morning) sigh!
When I start to feel depressed I will take those thoughts captive and replace it with the joy of knowing that I have been blessed in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ.
I will also remind myself that I was chosen before the Creation of world...just those two things are so incredibly awesome how can depression even begin?
Also I love the fact that I am twice adopted...first by human parents that actually wanted me, but even waaaaay more so by God the Father who loved me more than even any human could or can.
So when I start to feel depressed, I will replace gloomy thoughts and feelings with how much My Father in Heaven loves me, so much that He adopted me into His family.
I often feel so down when I sin ( not that it's wrong to grieve about sinning) but I also will replace what used to be endless berating myself about the sin, with the fact, that having confessed it, to know I am then instantly forgiven....I don't have to keep beating myself up.
Additionally I will remind myself I have been sealed and have the Holy Spirit...when I begin to see all the blessing and gifts I have been freely given they will help me turn from sorrow to joy.
Not only all these things will I remind myself of..
all these things I will replace the depressing thoughts with ( take them captive and replace them with the truth) I will also focus on the Lord's power which is so far beyond any that it in itself is a joyful thought. 
Keep up the good work hon. I'll try to get back here tomorrow if I can. But have to go get ready for a long doctor appointment now. Love you!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 1, 2017 11:25:36 GMT -5
I never ever thought about the possibility of the dad being in trouble, even as an adult!
In part, I kept thinking: I disobeyed....
tho, you were right ....
I only did so, in what seemed an emergency, to my thinking as a 5.
I do not know how long I was out there before the baby cried, but until she did, I did not go near where she was....not even to look (only) at her.
It sort of reminds me of Eve when speaking to satan....she added 'do not touch' to what God had actually said.....
I added... to their "Do not touch"....
Don't even go near the baby, or even go close, to look at her!
At first, I thought, Oh nooooo I wouldn't want him to have been in trouble....
but then ....
( again something I never thought of....
tho if it had been someone other than myself...I might have)
But when you pointed out his that his livid fury, rage, physical violent anger....might show up again with his own child, or wife....I could see how that might be dangerous to them sometime in the future.
I only thought he had a 'right' to be violently enraged, because he thought his brand new baby might be dead.....that was as far as I ever got,
and,
because that situation almost certainly would never happen again....
then, it would have been a one time break down of self-control....
to
what he thought was a possessed monster/child.
Yet, my eyes are opened to a different take....because if this happened to another child,
I would not have felt he was justified....
even IF his child was hurt....
because I would know he was an adult man, and the child would not have the experience of life as he should have,
instead he just let his fear and emotions take full control and he acted in a murderous rage.
I can see that was not a good thing (I suppose I have always know that in some way) but I keep thinking, but but.... he thought I killed his baby daughter....
and how could he then be logical?
Still, he reacted to what he thought was murder...with murder in his heart and intentions.....
I do pray the Lord dealt with him, what I mean is he would have to confess his sin, because that kind of rage is a sin, but then, I pray he, his wife daughter and any other child was saved.
Oh, and this is a weird thought, but do you think back in 1950...they would have truly thought he might need to go to jail? I can see that in our time, but back then?
Plus when my mom said: "they" said you did this......
I thought she meant the baby's parents said I tried to harm the little one.....
but maybe,
she meant to worker who picked me up and the wife.....but not the husband....
still, I don't think anything happened to him.....I have no basis for that....it just seems like in those days, a child would not be held in the same way as adults?
Sorry I added so much...but those were totally new thoughts for me...so I had to reflect on them.....like when you post brand new thoughts on some verse in scripture.
I just realized...I may not be making any sense.....I am not sure when I last slept LOL
I pray your doctor's appointment goes well?!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 2, 2017 23:20:04 GMT -5
I have been struggling for 2 days to stay awake.....I started reading Ephesians first thing this morning for about 1/2 an hour....I was committing key points to memory....but I only got 1/2 way thru...in a 1/2 hour because I kept falling asleep.
nevertheless, I did get some points for joy in my mind and will try again tomorrow to finish and may go over Ephesians 1.....one more time.
And will see what happens Monday.
But this sleepy thing, has happened before and it is really weird, because it is so unusual to be constantly waking and sleeping....weird.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 3, 2017 12:54:36 GMT -5
Today was much better....I was able to read Ephesians 1 with no sleeping in between!!
I am still tired but am much better as I slept well last night.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 4, 2017 13:36:33 GMT -5
Today I read and studied Ephesians ch. 2
I am wondering how your doctor's appointment went?
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Post by Cindy on Sept 5, 2017 12:18:48 GMT -5
Sorry; I didn't get back here like I wanted to. Besides just having to see the doctor and all the regular stuff, which I explained just now in Christian chat, I've also not been feeling very well. But I'm here now...I never ever thought about the possibility of the dad being in trouble, even as an adult!
In part, I kept thinking: I disobeyed....
tho, you were right ....
I only did so, in what seemed an emergency, to my thinking as a 5.
I do not know how long I was out there before the baby cried, but until she did, I did not go near where she was....not even to look (only) at her.
It sort of reminds me of Eve when speaking to satan....she added 'do not touch' to what God had actually said.....
I added... to their "Do not touch"....
Don't even go near the baby, or even go close, to look at her!
At first, I thought, Oh nooooo I wouldn't want him to have been in trouble....
but then ....
( again something I never thought of....
tho if it had been someone other than myself...I might have)
But when you pointed out his that his livid fury, rage, physical violent anger....might show up again with his own child, or wife....I could see how that might be dangerous to them sometime in the future.
I only thought he had a 'right' to be violently enraged, because he thought his brand new baby might be dead.....that was as far as I ever got,
and,
because that situation almost certainly would never happen again....
then, it would have been a one time break down of self-control....
to
what he thought was a possessed monster/child.
Yet, my eyes are opened to a different take....because if this happened to another child,
I would not have felt he was justified....
even IF his child was hurt....
because I would know he was an adult man, and the child would not have the experience of life as he should have,
instead he just let his fear and emotions take full control and he acted in a murderous rage.
I can see that was not a good thing (I suppose I have always know that in some way) but I keep thinking, but but.... he thought I killed his baby daughter....
and how could he then be logical?
Still, he reacted to what he thought was murder...with murder in his heart and intentions.....
I do pray the Lord dealt with him, what I mean is he would have to confess his sin, because that kind of rage is a sin, but then, I pray he, his wife daughter and any other child was saved.
Oh, and this is a weird thought, but do you think back in 1950...they would have truly thought he might need to go to jail? I can see that in our time, but back then?
Plus when my mom said: "they" said you did this......
I thought she meant the baby's parents said I tried to harm the little one.....
but maybe,
she meant to worker who picked me up and the wife.....but not the husband....
still, I don't think anything happened to him.....I have no basis for that....it just seems like in those days, a child would not be held in the same way as adults?
Sorry I added so much...but those were totally new thoughts for me...so I had to reflect on them.....like when you post brand new thoughts on some verse in scripture.
I just realized...I may not be making any sense.....I am not sure when I last slept LOL
I pray your doctor's appointment goes well?!
I have been struggling for 2 days to stay awake.....I started reading Ephesians first thing this morning for about 1/2 an hour....I was committing key points to memory....but I only got 1/2 way thru...in a 1/2 hour because I kept falling asleep.
nevertheless, I did get some points for joy in my mind and will try again tomorrow to finish and may go over Ephesians 1.....one more time.
And will see what happens Monday.
But this sleepy thing, has happened before and it is really weird, because it is so unusual to be constantly waking and sleeping....weird. Today was much better....I was able to read Ephesians 1 with no sleeping in between!!
I am still tired but am much better as I slept well last night.
Today I read and studied Ephesians ch. 2
I am wondering how your doctor's appointment went?
Ephesians 2 is important for many reasons, but also because he shows us that we are part of a body, part of a family and not alone - or at least we're not supposed to be. We actually need to be with others who are born again so that the body of Christ can operate like it's supposed to. “Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God’s people and members of God’s household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.” (Ephesians 2:19–22) We tend to individualize everything and make it all about us, and in some ways it is about us, but we forget that we are not complete unless we are with our brothers and sisters in the Lord and have them as our close and beloved friends and supporters; worshiping together, helping each others, and studying together to become all that we can be together in Him. I think that's happened because in the US as well as elsewhere, people have become loners and really don't want to be around other people. So we tend to ignore all the scriptures that speak of us being a body, and a family and take it all as though it's all meant just for us alone. But as we study we'll see that what affects one of us will affect all of us in the body, whether we realize it or not. (we also tend to forget that there's more to life than what we can see in the physical realm). It's certainly interesting to reflect on. It makes me think of how when we're saved, we're to "abide in Christ", we're living for Him, not ourselves, and like that, we're also to live for our brothers and sisters in Christ, just as He did. While He did die for us individually, He also died for all Gentiles and all Jew's and He tells us it was to make a brand new body of believers - a new "group" if you will, the Church - made up of both Jew's and Gentiles to be God's priests and ministers of reconciliation to the world.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 5, 2017 17:47:15 GMT -5
One last thing about my 5 year old incident....I just realized, the worker who picked me up,
never exam me......in fact, it wasn't until my adopted mom gave me a bath my first night there....and she called my dad to come and look at what was done....and I am pretty certain she would not have made waves about it.
I think they must have just told the authorities what I did and not a word about what he did. I was dressed in long sleeves etc from head to toe, when the worker came around noon to take me from there.....but I believe she only knew what I did, and was taking what she believed was a dangerous child away from their baby.
So God knows the truth and I do hope the man never lost it again, and also they all were saved at some point.
I am slowly getting a bit more sleep etc. Not sure exactly why I've been so tired.
I will go read what you wrote in chat so I can know what happened with you.
Oh and now I will go read what you wrote about Ephesians.
What can we tell a friend who keeps getting re-baptized?
When he found out Leonard has put in a request to our church for us to get baptized he now wants to get baptized yet again with us!
He just keeps going to different churches every couple of months.
He has lots of issues, one of them being doing things over and over.
He will buy weight lifting equipment for his apt. and work out for a few mts, then either give it away, sell it, throw it out etc. but in another 6 mts he will ask Leonard to help him go pick up weight lifting equipment all over again ( this has been going on for over 10 years). He does this with blankets, and the tent he pitches in his apt ( the tent is his only real furniture).
He has been told he is autistic, and schizophrenic....but since those are
just crazy physiological terms....I am not sure what is true about him?...but he did have a horrific childhood...
But besides not really wanting him to get baptized with us ( in part because he has a very strange fixation with me, Hossanah and Vanessa and even Devon to some extent)
But also, I really don't think a person is supposed to continue to keep getting baptized...I just don't know exactly how to explain it to him. He sometimes is very very smart, and other times we think he understands something, but the very next day, it's like he never heard a word we said.
he can have major angry melt downs too mostly in stores, but we never know when it will happen or why....
He can quote large passages of scripture and at times apply it to life very appropriately and other times, not so much.
But he is really really pushing getting baptized with Leonard and I and if possible Hossanah, Vanessa etc....for him it will be at least his 4th time ( but it may be many more times than that).
The church we go to also have Celebrate Recovery.....that he has been going to regularly.....
only yesterday he came over frantic, because they said he could not continue with the group because he refuses to talk about his childhood. he told me he quoted a bunch of passages ( eewhich he did for me yesterday) one was the one
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
he told them he did not want to say bad things about his mother because she was not there to defend herself ( she did do horrible horrible things to him and allow terrible things to happen to him)....he said he did not want to put such evil in their minds and so on.....
He says he cannot forgive her tho.....
But he needs their fellowship to keep sober.....
I am still kind of tired so this may not be very clear......
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Post by Cindy on Sept 6, 2017 10:13:34 GMT -5
One last thing about my 5 year old incident....I just realized, the worker who picked me up,
never exam me......in fact, it wasn't until my adopted mom gave me a bath my first night there....and she called my dad to come and look at what was done....and I am pretty certain she would not have made waves about it.
I think they must have just told the authorities what I did and not a word about what he did. I was dressed in long sleeves etc from head to toe, when the worker came around noon to take me from there.....but I believe she only knew what I did, and was taking what she believed was a dangerous child away from their baby.
So God knows the truth and I do hope the man never lost it again, and also they all were saved at some point.
I am slowly getting a bit more sleep etc. Not sure exactly why I've been so tired.
I will go read what you wrote in chat so I can know what happened with you.
Oh and now I will go read what you wrote about Ephesians.
What can we tell a friend who keeps getting re-baptized?
When he found out Leonard has put in a request to our church for us to get baptized he now wants to get baptized yet again with us!
He just keeps going to different churches every couple of months.
He has lots of issues, one of them being doing things over and over.
He will buy weight lifting equipment for his apt. and work out for a few mts, then either give it away, sell it, throw it out etc. but in another 6 mts he will ask Leonard to help him go pick up weight lifting equipment all over again ( this has been going on for over 10 years). He does this with blankets, and the tent he pitches in his apt ( the tent is his only real furniture).
He has been told he is autistic, and schizophrenic....but since those are
just crazy physiological terms....I am not sure what is true about him?...but he did have a horrific childhood...
But besides not really wanting him to get baptized with us ( in part because he has a very strange fixation with me, Hossanah and Vanessa and even Devon to some extent)
But also, I really don't think a person is supposed to continue to keep getting baptized...I just don't know exactly how to explain it to him. He sometimes is very very smart, and other times we think he understands something, but the very next day, it's like he never heard a word we said.
he can have major angry melt downs too mostly in stores, but we never know when it will happen or why....
He can quote large passages of scripture and at times apply it to life very appropriately and other times, not so much.
But he is really really pushing getting baptized with Leonard and I and if possible Hossanah, Vanessa etc....for him it will be at least his 4th time ( but it may be many more times than that).
The church we go to also have Celebrate Recovery.....that he has been going to regularly.....
only yesterday he came over frantic, because they said he could not continue with the group because he refuses to talk about his childhood. he told me he quoted a bunch of passages ( eewhich he did for me yesterday) one was the one
13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
he told them he did not want to say bad things about his mother because she was not there to defend herself ( she did do horrible horrible things to him and allow terrible things to happen to him)....he said he did not want to put such evil in their minds and so on.....
He says he cannot forgive her tho.....
But he needs their fellowship to keep sober.....
I am still kind of tired so this may not be very clear......
If you don't want him to be baptized with you, then you or Leonard need to let the Pastor know that and leave it up to him to decide. As far as being baptized again goes, there is nothing "wrong" with being baptized again, nor is there any specific number of times a person can be baptized. God doesn't really care about that. What He cares about is what's in the persons heart that's being baptized. If they were baptized 10 times before but didn't really mean that they intended to live for Christ and not themselves anymore, then those baptisms don't count anyway, and if they don't mean it this time, this one won't count either. However, if they have meant it before, then of course it counted, and if they mean it this time, it counts as well. Baptism doesn't save anyone, it just gets them wet. God saves us because of what's in our hearts, our desire to be saved by Him. Many people are baptized more than once, sometimes several times as they do it as a renewal of their vow to God to live for Him. Some churches are OK with that, and others aren't. It depends on how they view baptism, whether or not they see baptism as saving someone or not.
As far as him going to that other program and not talking about his childhood, that's up to him. No one can force him to talk about it. His quote of that verse is correct, but it also means that he should not even think about it, it's not just about talking about something. As you know, we're supposed to replace those memories with the Truth that God loves us and will never abuse us or forsake us, etc. He's also correct about not putting such evil in other people's minds. The church ought to listen to him about that. The world, Satan and our flesh love talking about and hearing about evil however. It's a part of our sin nature.
He does need to forgive them however, as God has told us that if we don't forgive others, He won't forgive us, but that's between him and God. “For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.” (Matthew 6:14–15) No one can force that group to accept him without speaking about his childhood, the most he could do is tell them that he had a very horrible childhood and has given it all to the Lord, and cannot speak of it any longer. If they still refuse, then he'll have to find some other group to help him. He should also remember that it's not the group that's keeping him sober, it's the Lord, and that the Lord will provide other support if he relies on Him and asks Him to.
As far as the psych labels go, they don't matter. What matters is his relationship with the Lord.
I'll quote MacArthur's devotional about this for you in case you need it for him:
Forgiveness removes the guilt and penalty of sin and restores intimacy with God.
Man’s greatest problem is sin. It renders him spiritually dead, alienates him from God and his fellowman, plagues him with guilt and fear, and can eventually damn him to eternal Hell. The only solution is forgiveness, and the only source of forgiveness is Jesus Christ.
All sin is punishable by death (Rom. 6:23), but Christ bore the sins of the world, thereby making it possible for us to be forgiven and to have eternal life through faith in Him (John 3:16). What a glorious reality!
Scripture speaks of two kinds of forgiveness: judicial and parental. Judicial forgiveness comes from God the righteous Judge, who wiped your sin off the record and set you free from its punishment and guilt. At the moment of your salvation He forgave all your sins—past, present, and future—and pronounced you righteous for all eternity. That’s why nothing can ever separate you from Christ’s love (Rom. 8:38–39).
Parental forgiveness is granted to believers by their loving Heavenly Father as they confess their sin and seek His cleansing. That’s the kind of forgiveness Jesus speaks of in Matthew 6:12.
When a child disobeys his father, the father/child relationship isn’t severed. The child is still a member of the family, and there’s a sense in which he is already forgiven because he’s under the umbrella of his father’s parental love. But some of the intimacy of their relationship is lost until the child seeks forgiveness.
That’s the idea in Matthew 6:12. The sins you commit as a believer don’t rob you of your salvation, but they do affect your relationship with God. He still loves you and will always be your Father, but the intimacy and sweet communion you once knew is jeopardized until you seek reconciliation by confessing your sins.
As a Christian, you are judicially forgiven and will never come into condemnation. But never presume on that grace. Make confession part of your daily prayers so sin will never erode your relationship with your Heavenly Father.
Drawing Near—Daily Readings for a Deeper Faith
Here's a prayer to have a forgiving heart from another of MacArthur's books:
O God, give me a heart of forgiveness, so that I may commune with You in the fullness of fellowship and joy and not experience the chastening that comes when You don’t forgive me because I won’t forgive a brother or sister in Christ. May I remember that for everyone who sins against me I have sinned multiplied times against You, and You have always forgiven me. At no time has any of my sin caused me to forfeit my eternal life; therefore, no one else’s sin should cause them to forfeit my love and my mercy toward them. Amen.
The pillars of Christian character: The basic essentials of a living faith
I'm only including this stuff because I assume you want to help him, although there's no way of knowing if he'll listen to you or not. In the long run though, if you choose to help him or rather try to help him, you have to remember that God is really the only one who can help him. Our job is only to point people to the Lord and encourage them to trust Him. When or if they choose not to do so, or choose not to accept our help or encouragement, that doesn't mean that we've failed. We can't fail as long as we continue to point them toward the Lord. We don't want them to rely on us, or anyone else, just God. If they don't, well then we have to leave it in God's hands and trust Him, just like we tell others to do.
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Post by Cindy on Sept 6, 2017 11:08:08 GMT -5
Back to the study. I assume your in or about to be in chapter 3 so I'll include some information here about it that's important for you.
“I pray that out of his glorious riches he may strengthen you with power through his Spirit in your inner being,” (Ephesians 3:16)
Spiritual power is a mark of every Christian who submits to God’s Word and Spirit. It is not reserved for some special class of Christian, but for all those who discipline their minds and spirits to study the Word, understand it, and live by it. Although the outer, physical person becomes weaker with age (cf. 2Co 4:16), the inner, spiritual person should grow stronger through the Holy Spirit, who will energize, revitalize, and empower the obedient, committed Christian (cf. Ac 1:8; Ro 8:5–9, 13; Gal 5:16). The MacArthur study Bible
How marvelous that God does not give the Spirit’s power to us “out of His riches” but “according to”—which is a far greater thing. If I am a billionaire & I give you ten dollars, I have given you out of my riches; but if I give you a million dollars, I have given to you according to my riches. The 1st is a portion; the 2nd is a proportion. This power is available for “the inner man.” This means the spiritual part of man where God dwells & works. The inner man of the lost sinner is dead (Eph. 2:1), but it becomes alive when Christ is invited in. The inner man can see (Ps. 119:18), hear (Matt. 13:9), taste (Ps. 34:8), & feel (Acts 17:27); & he must be “exercised” (1 Tim. 4:7–8). He also must be cleansed (Ps. 51:7) & fed (Matt. 4:4). The outer man is perishing, but the inner man can be renewed spiritually in spite of outward physical decay (2 Cor. 4:16–18). It is this inner power that makes him succeed. What does it mean to have the Holy Spirit empower the inner man? It means that our spiritual faculties are controlled by God, and we are exercising them and growing in the Word (Heb. 5:12–14). It is only when we yield to the Spirit and let Him control the inner man that we succeed in living to the glory of God. This means feeding the inner man the Word of God, praying and worshiping, keeping clean, and exercising the senses by loving obedience. The Bible exposition commentary
“in the inner man” Spiritual growth is internal, but it is stimulated by external pressure. Paul often uses the contrast between the inner man and the outer man. The inner man is the spiritual aspect, while the outer man is the physical aspect. The inner man is already part of the kingdom of God, but the outer man is still dying and struggling with the old age, the old fallen nature, and the fallen world system (cf. Eph. 2:1–3). Paul Bound, the Gospel Unbound
If you will reflect on all of this, you'll begin to see better that we can never really "die". Only our old physical body dies. That has to happen because as long as we are in this body, we can't be with our God who is Holy and pure. The death of this body is our graduation day - the day we become pure enough to be with our Father and our Lord Jesus! I'll post some more about it as it continues in the next verses:
“so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith. And I pray that you, being rooted and established in love,” (Ephesians 3:17)
Paul uses 3 pictures here to convey this idea of spiritual depth, & the 3 pictures are hidden in the 3 verbs: “dwell,” “rooted,” and “grounded.” The verb dwell literally means “to settle down and feel at home.” Certainly Christ was already resident in the hearts of the Ephesians, or else Paul would not have addressed them as “saints” in Eph 1:1. What Paul is praying for is a deeper experience between Christ & His people. He yearns for Christ to settle down & feel at home in their hearts—not a surface relationship, but an ever-deepening fellowship. Abraham’s life is an illustration of this truth. God was going to bless Abraham with a son, so the Lord Himself came down & visited Abraham’s tent, & brought 2 angels with Him. They came to the tent, talked with Abraham, & even ate a meal with him. They felt very much at home, because Abraham was a man of faith & obedience. Lot, a believer, was living in Sodom, & God wanted to warn him to get out before the judgment could fall. But the Lord Himself did not go to Sodom. He sent the 2 angels (Gen. 18–19). The Lord did not feel at home in Lot’s house the way He felt at home in Abraham’s tent. The verb rooted moves us into the plant world. The tree must get its roots deep into the soil if it is to have both nourishment & stability; & the Christian must have his spiritual roots deep into the love of God. Psalm 1:1–3 is a perfect description of this word, & Jeremiah 17:5–8 is a good commentary on it. If there is to be power in the Christian life, then there must be depth. The roots must go deeper & deeper into the love of Christ. Grounded refers to the foundations on which we build. In 2 churches I pastored, we constructed new buildings, & it seemed we'd never get off the ground. I complained, & was told, “The most important part of a building is the foundation. If you don’t go deep, you can’t go high.” That's been a sermon to me ever since. The trials of life test the depth of our experience & reveal the strength of our roots. Jesus told of 2 builders, 1 who didn't go deep enough for his foundation (Matt. 7:24–29). Paul prayed they might have a deeper experience with Christ, because only a deep experience could sustain them during the severe trials of life. The Bible exposition commentary
This is what I pray for you regularly!
“That he may dwell”; not that he may call upon you sometimes, as a casual visitor enters into a house & tarries for a night, but that he may dwell; that Jesus may become the Lord & Tenant of your inmost being, never more to go out. Observe the words—that he may dwell in your heart, not in your thoughts alone, but in your affections; not merely in the mind’s meditations, but in the heart’s emotions. Morning and evening
When you notice how difficult really loving others is, you need to remember and experience once again all the riches that are already yours in Christ. You have a present relationship with him! He has given you so much relational wealth that you can readily afford to give it away. And since you are giving out of your excess, you don’t need to wheedle a handout from anyone else. If you catch yourself doing that, take a moment and pray through Ephesians 3:14–19, “For this reason I kneel before the Father, from whom his whole family in heaven and on earth derives its name. I pray that out of his glorious riches he may strengthen you with power through his Spirit in your inner being, so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith. And I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ, and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.” Ask Jesus to fill your heart with the knowledge of the breadth, length, height, and depth of his love for you. Ask him to fill you with joy in the inheritance you already have from him. As he answers that prayer, you will be able to genuinely love the difficult people in your life. Heart of the matter
“may have power, together with all the saints, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ,” (Ephesians 3:18)
ESV | may be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
The words “comprehend” & “apprehend” both stem from the Latin word prehendere which means “to grasp.” Our word comprehend has the idea of mentally grasping something; while apprehend suggests laying hold of it for yourself. In other words, it is possible to understand something but not really make it your own. Paul’s concern is that we lay hold of the vast expanses of the love of God. He wants us to live in 4 dimensions. When God gave the land to Abraham, He told him to “walk through the land in the length of it and in the breadth of it” (Gen. 13:17). Abraham had to step out by faith & claim his inheritance. But we today have an inheritance in 4 dimensions: breadth, length, depth, & height. God’s 4th dimension is love! But there is a paradox here. Paul wants us to know personally the love of Christ “which passeth knowledge.” There are dimensions, but they cannot be measured. “The love of Christ which passeth knowledge” parallels “the unsearchable riches of Christ” (Eph. 3:8). We are so rich in Christ that our riches cannot be calculated even with the most sophisticated computer. No Christian ever has to worry about having inadequate spiritual resources to meet the demands of life. If he prays for spiritual strength and spiritual depth, he will be able to apprehend—get his hands on—all the resources of God’s love and grace. “I can do all things through Christ who gives me strength” (Phil. 4:13). The Bible exposition commentary
“and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.” (Ephesians 3:19)
to know the love of Christ. Not the love believers have for Christ, but the love of & from Christ that He places in their hearts before they can truly & fully love Him or anyone else (Ro 5:5). which surpasses knowledge. Knowledge of Christ’s love is far beyond the capability of human reason & experience. It is only known by those who are God’s children (cf. Php 4:7). filled up to all the fullness of God. To be so strong spiritually, so compelled by divine love, that one is totally dominated by the Lord with nothing left of self. Human comprehension of the fullness of God is impossible, because even the most spiritual & wise believer cannot completely grasp the full extent of God’s attributes & characteristics—His power, majesty, wisdom, love, mercy, patience, kindness, & everything He is & does. But believers can experience the greatness of God in their lives as a result of total devotion to Him.
Note the fullness of God, here; the fullness of Christ in Ephesians 4:13; & the fullness of the Spirit in Ephesians 5:18. The MacArthur study Bible
The more a Christian knows about Christ, the more amazed he is at Christ’s love for him. The final purpose is that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God. The KJV & RSV translations, “that you may be filled with all the fullness of God,” wrongly imply that the whole fullness of God can be contained in a believer’s life. But this ignores the Greek preposition eis which denotes a goal; this is translated accurately in the NIV: “to the measure.” The fullness of the Godhead is only in Christ, and only through Him is a believer made complete (Col. 2:9–10). Though in Christ this divine fullness is ideally a believer’s already, Paul prayed that it might be experientially realized in each one (Eph. 4:13). Experiencing God’s moral excellence & perfection causes Jewish & Gentile believers to love each other. Positionally they are one in Christ; experientially they are to love each other as one in Him. The Bible Knowledge Commentary
“Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than all we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us,” (Ephesians 3:20)
Note again the trinitarian emphasis in this benediction: Paul prays to God the Father, concerning the indwelling power of God the Spirit, made available through God the Son. Now unto Him that is able to do all, above all, abundantly above all, exceeding abundantly above all. Paul seems to want to use every word possible to convey to us the vastness of God’s power as found in Jesus Christ. He has ended each of the two previous chapters with praise to God for His great victory in Christ. He tells us that Christ’s power is so great He arose from the dead & ascended far above all (Eph. 1:19–23). He teaches us that His power is so great He has reconciled Jews & Gentiles to each other, & to God; & that He is now building a temple to the eternal glory of God (Eph. 2:19–22). But in the paragraph before us, Paul shares the exciting truth that this far above all power is available to us! It is even “above all that we ask or think.” In other words, the power of Christ, like the love of Christ, is beyond human understanding or measurement. And this is just the kind of power you & I need if we are to walk & war in victory. The word “power” is again dunamis, & “working” is energeia (energy) found in Ephesians 1:11, 19; Some power is dormant; it is available, but not being used, such as the power stored in a battery. But God’s energy is effectual power—power at work in our lives. This power works in us, in the inner man (Eph. 3:16). Phil 2:12–13 are parallel verses, so be sure to read them. It is the Holy Spirit who releases the resurrection power of Christ in our lives. Unbelief, unconfessed sin, careless living, worldliness in action or attitude—all of these can rob us of power. And a Christian robbed of power cannot be used of God. “Without Me, ye can do nothing” (John 15:5). The Bible exposition commentary
That’s more than a truckload of love that God wants us to experience in our lives! It’s a love so big, it can drive fear from your life & fill the deepest cracks of your soul with satisfaction. A love that rests in knowing you’re His, secure in His care, wholeness, goodness, power, & restoration—His fullness. It is a love so powerful that it frees you to live in perfect security because Love Himself loves you. Thriving
I'll end here for now. Hope you have a good day!
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 6, 2017 11:38:12 GMT -5
Thank you so much for addressing the issues with our friend. I am really glad I asked because I was thinking he should not be getting baptized over and over, so it was good to know that it is not necessarily wrong.
And yes, I was onto Ephesians 3.....I have read your post once, but will go back, and put notes in my journal, and read more carefully and thoughtfully.
I did read about your doctor's appointment. I have lost about 2 inches in height but I just assumed it was part of aging....will be interested in finding out if yours is related to something else.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 6, 2017 23:43:32 GMT -5
I got the notes in my journal for 3...thank you so much
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Post by Cindy on Sept 7, 2017 11:48:06 GMT -5
Thank you so much for addressing the issues with our friend. I am really glad I asked because I was thinking he should not be getting baptized over and over, so it was good to know that it is not necessarily wrong.
And yes, I was onto Ephesians 3.....I have read your post once, but will go back, and put notes in my journal, and read more carefully and thoughtfully.
I did read about your doctor's appointment. I have lost about 2 inches in height but I just assumed it was part of aging....will be interested in finding out if yours is related to something else.
I got the notes in my journal for 3...thank you so much
I can't remember if I told you this or not, but Philippians 2:12–13 is a parallel verse to Ephesians 3:20–21, so you should read that as well.
“to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever and ever! Amen.” (Ephesians 3:21)
The primary motive of the church is to glorify God. Paul described salvation as being “to the praise of the glory of his grace”(Eph. 1:6). Truth for today
to Him be the glory. Only when His children meet this level of faithfulness will Christ be fully glorified with the honor He deserves from His church. MacArthur
We’ve experienced God’s saving power & seen Him answer prayer, & yet there are times when we let pessimism rob us of the joy of seeing Him work through obstacles in our lives. Don’t let that happen to you. Keep your eyes on Christ, & trust in His sufficiency. He will never fail you! Memorize Eph 3:20–21. Recite it often as a hymn of praise & affirmation of your faith in God. Drawing Near
Get your hands on your spiritual wealth by opening your heart to the Holy Spirit, and praying with Paul for strength for the inner man … for a new depth of love … for spiritual apprehension … and for spiritual fullness. “Ye have not because ye ask not” (James 4:2). The Bible exposition commentary
Again, if you want those things, don't put off writing your prayer for it, or copying Ephesians 3:16–21 and changing it so it's your prayer for yourself. I also wanted to share this with you:
Many have used JOY as an acrostic to define our priorities. J is for Jesus, who comes first, then others (O), and finally, yourself (Y). If we put ourselves first, we will become selfish people, isolated and with little reason to rejoice. But if we put Jesus first and imitate Him in looking after the needs of others, we will find ourselves experiencing selfless joy more regularly. Take joy today in another’s success, even if you were unable to attain the goal he achieved. Tabletalk Magazine
Remember, what I'd like to see is what you're getting from each chapter that will help you with your plan, and how it will help......
In case you start on Ephesians 4:
For Ephesians 4:1–3 also read James 3:13–4:10 for the most vivid treatment of war and peace in the New Testament.
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 7, 2017 12:08:03 GMT -5
Yes I did reflect on it...actually writing it down is a step for me on the way to getting it into my heart, and I almost always pray/talk to the Lord about it...like I may say: Thank you Lord for assuring me I will never die, but only have a never ending future and always growing one for all eternity with you. etc etc.
Writing in the journal is like just another way of going over what I read, in a slower more thoughtful way, then I may read it a 3rd or 4th time ( looking up the notes if I did not do that in my first reading).
It almost always surprises me that on a 2nd or even a third reading, something different will call to me. I wonder, why did I not really catch that before?
But I think because I reflected on certain things the first time, the 2nd, 3rd or 4th time, I can reflect on something different.
I not only now write in my journal, I often, not only underline, but may write notes in my Bible.
( as much as space will allow).
I mention writing in my journal because for a long time, I would totally forget about it and of course, would NOT write in it. I might write a verse down on a 3 x 5 card, or on a pad of paper....but not in the journal, this is the first time, I have been more disciplined to do so.
You had said years ago to Eva and I we should always have our journals nearby to write in....but I never was disciplined to do so.....for a while now I have been, that's why I mentioned it.
I think I have said in other posts that I reflected on the passages we studied? I guess I just thought you knew, that I knew, that is what we are supposed to do...and want to do.
I was just excited that I have managed for a time now, to actually do what you asked...what 10 years ago?
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fearnot
Living With Pain
Posts: 6,426
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Post by fearnot on Sept 7, 2017 13:19:15 GMT -5
I have been remembering to wake up and smile at Jesus, to count my blessing,
to remember a joy verse ( about 1/2 the time) to look forward to something about 80 % of the time, to take any depressing thoughts captive, to sing to myself a hymn or worship song 90% of the time.
As to Ephesians ch. 3
When I start to think of what I think I have 'lost' I will remind myself that I have boundless and endless riches and blessings in Jesus and an eternity of them coming in the not so distant future ( which actually in most ways is better than when I was young and would have to wait, 50, 60 years or more before getting close....the best is yet to come.
I can also reflect on the fact, that I am able to come close to the throne of God in prayer with freedom and confidence and ask Him, talk to Him about.....whatever is on my mind and heart and spirit.
Also when depression tries to bring me down, I will remind myself that I have Jesus's power in my heart through faith, His love that surpasses knowledge,
and that He is able to do more than I can even imagine....imagine!!!
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Post by Cindy on Sept 8, 2017 10:26:13 GMT -5
Yes I did reflect on it...actually writing it down is a step for me on the way to getting it into my heart, and I almost always pray/talk to the Lord about it...like I may say: Thank you Lord for assuring me I will never die, but only have a never ending future and always growing one for all eternity with you. etc etc.
Writing in the journal is like just another way of going over what I read, in a slower more thoughtful way, then I may read it a 3rd or 4th time ( looking up the notes if I did not do that in my first reading).
It almost always surprises me that on a 2nd or even a third reading, something different will call to me. I wonder, why did I not really catch that before?
But I think because I reflected on certain things the first time, the 2nd, 3rd or 4th time, I can reflect on something different.
I not only now write in my journal, I often, not only underline, but may write notes in my Bible.
( as much as space will allow).
I mention writing in my journal because for a long time, I would totally forget about it and of course, would NOT write in it. I might write a verse down on a 3 x 5 card, or on a pad of paper....but not in the journal, this is the first time, I have been more disciplined to do so.
You had said years ago to Eva and I we should always have our journals nearby to write in....but I never was disciplined to do so.....for a while now I have been, that's why I mentioned it.
I think I have said in other posts that I reflected on the passages we studied? I guess I just thought you knew, that I knew, that is what we are supposed to do...and want to do.
I was just excited that I have managed for a time now, to actually do what you asked...what 10 years ago?
I have been remembering to wake up and smile at Jesus, to count my blessing,
to remember a joy verse ( about 1/2 the time) to look forward to something about 80 % of the time, to take any depressing thoughts captive, to sing to myself a hymn or worship song 90% of the time.
As to Ephesians ch. 3
When I start to think of what I think I have 'lost' I will remind myself that I have boundless and endless riches and blessings in Jesus and an eternity of them coming in the not so distant future ( which actually in most ways is better than when I was young and would have to wait, 50, 60 years or more before getting close....the best is yet to come.
I can also reflect on the fact, that I am able to come close to the throne of God in prayer with freedom and confidence and ask Him, talk to Him about.....whatever is on my mind and heart and spirit.
Also when depression tries to bring me down, I will remind myself that I have Jesus's power in my heart through faith, His love that surpasses knowledge,
and that He is able to do more than I can even imagine....imagine!!!
I want to take a minute and explain Ephesians 4:8-10 as it's a verse that much false teaching surrounds. “This is why it says: “When he ascended on high, he led captives in his train and gave gifts to men.” (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions? He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.)” (Ephesians 4:8–10)
The false teachers take these passages and say that they mean that Jesus went to hell when He died, but they don't mean that at all! Again, we have to remember to read everything in context of what's written around it and in the context of the whole Bible. Just prior to this, Paul was speaking about how we're all part of the Body of Christ and then, speaking of that he says: “But to each one of us grace has been given as Christ apportioned it.” (Ephesians 4:7) So we see that now Paul's gone back to talking about the gifts, the spiritual blessings Jesus gives each of us. Paul is interpreting Psalm 68:18 to show how Jesus got the right to give us these spiritual gifts. Here's what more about this:
Psalm 68 is a victory hymn composed by David to celebrate God’s conquest of the Jebusite city of Jerusalem & the triumphant ascent of God up to Mt. Zion. After such a triumph, the king would bring home the spoils & the prisoners. Here Paul depicts Christ returning from His battle on earth back into the glory of the heavenly city with the trophies of His great victory at Calvary (see notes on 2Co 2:14–16). Led captive a host of captives. Through His crucifixion & resurrection, Christ conquered Satan & death, & in triumph returned to God those who were once sinners & prisoners of Satan (cf. Col 2:15). Gave gifts to men. He distributes the spoils throughout His kingdom. After His ascension came all the spiritual gifts empowered by the Spirit, who was then sent (see John 7:39; John 14:12; Acts 2:33). Ascended. Jesus’ ascension from earth to heaven (Ac 1:9–11), where He forever reigns with His Father. Descended. This refers to Christ’s incarnation, when He came down from heaven as a man into the earth of suffering and death. The lower parts of the earth. These are in contrast to the highest heavens to which He afterward ascended (cf. Ps 139:8, 15; Is 44:23). The phrase here does not point to a specific place, but to the great depth, as it were, of the incarnation, including Christ’s descent, between His crucifixion & resurrection beyond the earth, the grave, & death, into the very pit of the demons, “the spirits in prison” (see notes on Col 2:14, 15; 1Pe 3:18, 19). That He might fill all things. After the Lord ascended, having fulfilled all prophecies and all His divinely-ordained redemptive tasks, He gained the right to rule the church and to give gifts, as He was then filling the entire universe with His divine presence, power, sovereignty, and blessing (cf. Php 2:9–11). The MacArthur study Bible
Some think the phrase “the lower parts of the earth” refers to Hades (metaphorically below the earth). Most, however, agree that these regions are set opposite the “heavens,” from which Christ descended to earth to give gifts to His church. The Apologetics Study Bible
The essence of the psalm is that a military victor has the right to give gifts to those who are identified with him. Jesus descended to the Earth to be born as a baby, then when He had fulfilled the Father's Will, after His resurrection, He ascended to Heaven. Those who claim the verses speak of Jesus going to hell, link it to other verses as well:
“For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,” (1 Peter 3:18–20)
made proclamation. Between Christ’s death and resurrection, His living spirit went to the demon spirits bound in the abyss & proclaimed that, in spite of His death, He had triumphed over them. spirits now in prison. This refers to fallen angels (demons), who were permanently bound because of heinous wickedness. The demons who are not so bound resist such a sentence (cf. Lk 8:31). In the end, they will all be sent to the eternal lake of fire (Mt 25:41; Rev 20:10). The MacArthur study Bible
Then according to Peter, sometime between His death & His resurrection Jesus made a special proclamation to “the spirits in prison.” Those who say that these “spirits in prison” were the spirits of lost sinners in hell, to whom Jesus brought the good news of salvation, have some real problems to solve. To begin with, Peter referred to people as “souls” & not “spirits” (1 Peter 3:20). In the NT, the word “spirits” is used to describe angels or demons, not human beings; & 1 Peter 3:22 seems to argue for this meaning. Furthermore, nowhere in the Bible are we told that Jesus visited hell. Acts 2:31 states that He went to “hades” (nasb), but “hades” is not hell. The word “hades” refers to the realm of the unbelieving dead, a temporary place where they await the resurrection. Read Rev 20:11–15 in the NASB or the NIV & you will see the important distinction. Hell is the permanent & final place of judgment for the lost. Hades is the temporary place. When a Christian dies, he goes to neither place, but to heaven to be with Christ (Phil. 1:20–24). Our Lord yielded His spirit to the Father, died, & at some time between death & resurrection, visited the realm of the dead where He delivered a message to spirit beings (probably fallen angels; see Jude 6) who were somehow related to the period before the Flood. 1 Peter 3:20 makes this clear. The word translated “preached” simply means “to announce as a herald, to proclaim.” It is not the word that means “to preach the Gospel” that Peter used in 1 Peter 1:12 & 4:6. Peter did not tell us what Jesus proclaimed to them, but it couldn't be a message of redemption as angels can't be saved. It was probably a declaration of victory over Satan & his hosts (see Col. 2:15; 1 Peter 3:22). How these spirits were related to the pre-Flood era, isn't explained. Some believe they were “the sons of God” in Gen 6:1–4, but I can't accept that. The good angels who did not fall are called “sons of God,” but not the fallen angels (Job 1:6; 2:1, & note that Satan is distinguished from the “sons of God”). The world before the Flood was unbelievably wicked, & these spirits had much to do with it (see Gen. 6:5–13; Rom. 1:18ff). The Bible exposition commentary
“And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.” (Colossians 2:15) .
had disarmed. In yet another element of the cross work, Paul tells that the cross spelled the ultimate doom of Satan and his evil host of fallen angels (cf. Ge 3:15; Jn 12:31; 16:11; Heb 2:14). rulers and authorities. See note on 1:16. While His body was dead, His living, divine spirit actually went to the abode of demons and announced His triumph over sin, Satan, death, and hell. See notes on 1Pe 3:18, 19. made a public display … triumphed over them. The picture is that of a victorious Roman general parading his defeated enemies through the streets of Rome (see notes on 2Co 2:14–16). Christ won the victory over the demon forces on the cross, where their efforts to halt God’s redemptive plan were ultimately defeated. For more on that triumphant imagery, see notes on 2Co 2:14–16. As evidenced by His perfect fulfillment of His Father’s will, Christ possessed the authority & sovereignty to assign the spiritual gifts (Ephesians 4:7–8) to those He has called into service in His church. He gave not only gifts, but gifted men. (Ephesians 4:11) The MacArthur study Bible
Jesus not only dealt with sin and the Law on the cross, but He also dealt with Satan. Speaking about His crucifixion, Jesus said, “Now is the judgment of this world; now shall the prince of this world be cast out” (John 12:31). The death of Christ on the cross looked like a great victory for Satan, but it turned out to be a great defeat from which Satan cannot recover. Jesus had 3 great victories on the cross. 1st, He “disarmed the powers and authorities” stripping Satan & his army of whatever weapons they held. Satan cannot harm the believer who will not harm himself. It is when we cease to watch & pray (as did Peter) that Satan can use his weapons against us. 2nd, Jesus “made a public spectacle” of the enemy, exposing Satan’s deceit & vileness. In His death, resurrection, & ascension, Christ vindicated God & vanquished the devil. His 3rd victory is found in the word triumph. Whenever a Roman general won a great victory on foreign soil, took many captives & much loot, & gained new territory for Rome, he was honored by an official parade known as “the Roman triumph.” Paul alluded to this practice in 2 Cor. 2:14. Jesus Christ won a complete victory, & He returned to glory in a great triumphal procession (Eph. 4:8ff). In this, He disgraced & defeated Satan. You & I share in His victory over the devil. We need not worry about the elemental forces that govern the planets & try to influence men’s lives. The satanic armies of principalities & powers are defeated & disgraced! As we claim the victory of Christ, use the equipment He has provided for us (Eph. 6:10ff), & trust Him, we are free from the influence of the devil. What a wonderful position & provision we have in Christ! Are we living up to it by faith? The Bible exposition commentary
For a long time I didn't know what to think about these verses, but now that I've studied them, it makes a lot of sense, and what the false teachers say doesn't make sense at all anymore. They have to force the puzzle pieces to fit, but when you study with the Lord's guidance, the puzzle pieces fall into place all by themselves. The reason I took the time to show what this really is saying, isn't just to make people aware of the false teaching on this subject, but because when we understand what Jesus really did, what these verses are all saying, it shows us yet more about our glorious and mighty God and just how much He loves us and how He loves to give us good and perfect gifts! Notice too that while He does this for each of us, the purpose is not just for us individually, even though it does help us each individually. The purpose is stated in Ephesians 4:12–13
“to prepare God’s people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.” (Ephesians 4:12–13) He speaks of that later as well: “to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.” (Ephesians 5:26–27) It's all about the Body of Christ, working together to bring God glory and do His Will.
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My Plan with the Lord to overcome depression
